Engine teardown and inspection

[cantarauk]

That is brilliant thank you very much.

Was going to ask second gear No7 in parts image did that come off easy enough as mine seems stuck.

Then for circlips any reason why not to use similar to below.



Washer with the tags that I have the wrong way round so thank you very much I will have to go and rectify that.

[Bryanj]

 Dont think you can use that type of circlip as the ears are too big

[cantarauk]

Hi Bryan,

I had a few of the circlips I order a while back and did a quick assemble using them.





The ears are a bit big but do pretty much align with the end of the washer. Any good ?

[Trigger]

You CAN NOT use that type as, it does not have a running surface. you need the type like the Honda ones that have flat one side and a bevel sided 
What happened to the ones you took off ?

[cantarauk]

Roger that Tigger.

The one I took off has a kink in the middle like it was bent and then straightened. From the initial inspection of the engine I made a decision to strip down completely as I was very unsure about how well it had been assembled in the past. If recall at the start of this post I found a primary chain link in the oil pan and also terrible wear on cam, and cam head surface bearings.

I have 550 engine so will steal one of there and replace that one when I get around to the 550.

[Trigger]

Set rings (Honda circlips)are ready available for a couple of quid, 90602259010 

[cantarauk]

Cheers

Placed a David silver order straight after I sent that post as I realised I did not fancy all the work to get them from the other engine. I can wait a few days

[cantarauk]

On closer inspection of the pictures you sent over Trigger I was still wondering why the second gear (No 7 in parts list) was stuck. I gave it quite a few taps and got it off the shaft but guess what I found is not what I wanted to.

Image of the shaft where the second gear came off. Am I right in assuming this means it needs replacing ?





Then the gear itself -




I can only assume something has gone in and around here or am I off the mark ?

 

 

[Trigger]

Always worth stripping a gear box down as, you never know what you will find  Looks like oil starvation but, not much heat. Expensive to find a good replacement 

[cantarauk]

Is the shaft the same as the 550 ?

[Trigger]

Is the shaft the same as the 550 ?

Nope, 550 is 374 and the 500 is 323 

[Oddjob]

20 is the thrust washer and 19 is the tabbed washer.

Were you aware that the tabbed washer is used to lock the thrust washer into place, in that the tabs don't face toward the gears , they face toward the thrust washer.

Oh and the 2 washer thing, the smaller holed washer is the correct one, I suspect that whoever re-built the box forgot where things go and put the clutch basket thrust washer onto the mainshaft instead, was there a washer behind the clutch basket?

[cantarauk]

Hi Oddjob,

Thank you for checking and getting back to me.

I was not aware of which way the lock and tab washers faced but after very close inspection from Triggers images I gather I had assembled incorrectly. Upon stripping down again I was still puzzled to why the second gear was stuck to shaft and difficult to remove so I made an effort to get this off and inspect further as you can read from above.

Will check the bag with all the clutch parts and also the photos I have when I stripped down and get back to you and thanks for the steer and advice.

[cantarauk]

Is the shaft the same as the 550 ?

Nope, 550 is 374 and the 500 is 323 

Trigger can I ask if I find a good condition second hand one how would I tell the difference between a 500 and 550 as the images in the parts manuals look the same. I know I can't trust the manual so advice appreciated

[Oddjob]

My initial thought was that the 500 and 550 are interchangeable, I’m not 100% sure of this without checking and I’m at work right now. The 550 countershaft was changed from the 500, hence the different part number, however I strongly suspect that the only difference was internal and not external. Some of the 500s suffered from needle bearing failure due to lack of oil, to prevent this Honda fitted a small oil pump inside the needle bearing and to run this fitted a small gear internally inside the countershaft, this I suspect is why it had to change part number. Fit the 500 needle bearing on it and I think it should fit. You’d need to compare the 500 and 550 shafts side by side to check of course but I think they are identical except for that gear, the gears however are not so you’d need to use the 500 gears on the 550 shaft. Compare part numbers for 2nd gear as that gear may be the same on both engines.

I threw 3 countershafts out last year, couldn’t see the need to keep them, however I would have kept at least one as a just in case part along with a spare set of gears. I’d need to dig in my big box of bits but I’m fairly sure I’ll have what you need. If I have you can have them foc, just pay postage which may be high as the shaft is heavy.