Author Topic: 1969 CL450 US Barn Find Restoration  (Read 31474 times)

Offline jensen

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #45 on: December 05, 2017, 07:58:29 PM »
It's an easy job, the plugs aren't hardened. The new plugs can be made from aluminium and pressed in. Never tried steam, but I don't know if I wanted water in my big end bearings  ;) as you mentioned. Next to solvents, patience is mandatory, but mechanical removing is always to prefer....
« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 08:08:10 PM by jensen »
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Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #46 on: December 07, 2017, 11:07:28 AM »
If you read this fascinating rebuild, linked below, Graham Curtiss (Gman) deals with cleaning cranks on his early CB72. Fascinating stuff. He also is going to show me his jig he constructed for stripping and aligning Honda pressed together cranks the next  time I am near Derby. The whole set of  posts makes a cracking good read for any Honda nut like me. But the crank stripping starts here:-

http://www.honda305.com/forums/1961-cb72-project-t7634421-525.html
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #47 on: December 07, 2017, 03:44:56 PM »
I see what you mean about my crank being like the CB350 one. As the race shop who are going to clean the crank out do loads of them it will be in good hands. I asked about just cleaning, and got this reply:

Quote
Hello Dave,
We do quite a few 450 and 350 cranks and I do prefer to 'pull' the outer flywheels off, inspect the cages, rods & pins at the same time as cleaning the sludge traps. Obviously the oil passes through the middle main bearings as it is fed to the big ends and it is far better for cleaning if the crank is pulled down as I mentioned. We can then replace the blanks once we have cleaned and inspected the delivery holes.
Cheers

I'm going to leave it in his hands, I guess he will have also seen the kind of damage shown in that thread loads of times, that crank has had a hard life!

I found a plastic box the right size, but no lid. I bought 2 and cut the bottom off one to make a lid, its now in there with a load of bubblewrap. Tonight I'll seal it up, weigh it and look on Parclemonkey for carriage options, that worked well when I sent my CB750 stuff to Menno.

 Of course when i picked the crank up, rollers went everywhere, I rounded them up and put them in a freezer bag. I'm guessing grease is the word when you are putting the crank back in.

On another topic, here are my two tachos, never one for an easy life I'm now considering swapping their insides, to use the steel outer, matching my vgc speedo, and the unfaded guts of the plastic one.


« Last Edit: September 24, 2018, 04:45:27 PM by MrDavo »
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline kent400

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #48 on: December 07, 2017, 05:12:38 PM »
When you do swap the tacho internals over do check the dial face screws are tight as they have a tendency to become loose on the types with a metal face and the small-headed screws. Also check the inside of the base is ensure there is no corrosion, if there is flakes of rust can be attracted to the internal magnet and jam the gauge. The light tubes can also come loose, they are only glued in and a spot of two-part resin adhesive will resolve that.

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #49 on: December 08, 2017, 12:31:11 AM »
Will do, thanks. My first concern is getting in and out without butchering the bezel.

Does anyone know what the difference is between CL450 and CL350 / SL350 handlebars? All three have different part numbers, but the difference is the three digit model code in the middle. I’m asking as I need a set of bars and some 350 ones have come up on the bay of fleas.

Maybe the 450 bars are wider because it’s a bigger bike, but I don’t know and can’t find out.

ETA: I bought a pair of round tank badges today with the '450' underneath, see 'Desperately Seeking' for a picture.

Here's the link in case James wants a more correct set   ;) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/152820302352
« Last Edit: December 08, 2017, 05:30:41 PM by MrDavo »
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #50 on: December 11, 2017, 12:59:54 PM »
I didn't get as much done this weekend - Saturday I went for a walk in the snow with the Mrs, when we came back (after a good pub lunch) it was so nice to get back in the warm I couldn't face the cold garage, fan heater or not. Anyway, my mate said on Friday night that I'd better slow down, or I'll be after another project in the new year :)

Sunday I did a bit, painted the headlamp shell and a guage case satin black (warmed the paint in hot water first) and started to get my head together, man. Remember that rusty valve seat on the last page, that had been left open for many years? Here it is after a dose of grinding paste and elbow grease.



While I had the head down off the shelf I couldn't resist unwrapping the barrels and trying them both on over the studs, to see how the cleaned but empty engine looked.




A question regarding old rubber - the carb intake manifolds are cast in rubber, but have gone so hard over time that I thought at first they were fibre or even some kind of metal, until I thought about how the carbs were fastened on using a hose clip, which must be able to compress the manifold material to make an airtight seal. New manifolds are £50 a pair at DS, do I need to bite the bullet, or is there anthing I could try soaking them in to soften them?

EDIT: Just seen a post Ash just made, by concidence, adressing this very issue!
« Last Edit: September 24, 2018, 04:46:13 PM by MrDavo »
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #51 on: December 11, 2017, 02:18:47 PM »
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #52 on: December 11, 2017, 02:20:04 PM »
You ninja'd my edit!

Duinno if I can get that Refos stuff but I will root in the wife's potion drawer looking for wintergreen.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2017, 02:23:54 PM by MrDavo »
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #53 on: December 11, 2017, 02:52:33 PM »
You ninja'd my edit!

Duinno if I can get that Refos stuff but I will root in the wife's potion drawer looking for wintergreen.

Send them here if you wish.
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #54 on: December 11, 2017, 03:23:13 PM »
Thanks very much, Ash, it would be the 'green' thing to recycle the manifolds, they are perfect apart from being rock hard. I'll chuck them in a jiffy bag later in the week and send them over.



1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #55 on: December 13, 2017, 06:59:26 PM »
My crank is ready! That was a quick turnround, Mike says he likes to squeeze these small jobs in between the big ones.

Quote
The crank has been stripped, cleaned, crank pin oil plugs removed, sludge traps cleaned, re-placement oil plugs fitted, crank rebuilt and trued.
It is now ready to be shipped back to you.

Yes the bearings were all OK to use. Obviously they are not new but from our experience all serviceable. There was no more crud that usual and the pins, cages, needles and big end eyes were all good to go. One of the small end eyes is getting towards the limit but tried it with a new pin and it should be good for a few more miles yet.

My carb rubbers have been posted of to Ashley, to be soaked in magic fluid, and I decided to send my two tachos to Pete for swapping the insides over as I wasn't confident I could get them apart and back together without messing them up, I'd rather pay to have it done right.

James is looking for some bars for me, as usual this board is proving to be invaluable, both for advice and services - my CB750 runs on what used to be Ash's spare crank, and I rebuilt that engine without major dramas thanks to the advice I got from here, for example when the oil pump wouldn't prime.
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline royhall

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #56 on: December 13, 2017, 09:39:52 PM »
My crank is ready! That was a quick turnround, Mike says he likes to squeeze these small jobs in between the big ones.

Quote
The crank has been stripped, cleaned, crank pin oil plugs removed, sludge traps cleaned, re-placement oil plugs fitted, crank rebuilt and trued.
It is now ready to be shipped back to you.

Yes the bearings were all OK to use. Obviously they are not new but from our experience all serviceable. There was no more crud that usual and the pins, cages, needles and big end eyes were all good to go. One of the small end eyes is getting towards the limit but tried it with a new pin and it should be good for a few more miles yet.

My carb rubbers have been posted of to Ashley, to be soaked in magic fluid, and I decided to send my two tachos to Pete for swapping the insides over as I wasn't confident I could get them apart and back together without messing them up, I'd rather pay to have it done right.

James is looking for some bars for me, as usual this board is proving to be invaluable, both for advice and services - my CB750 runs on what used to be Ash's spare crank, and I rebuilt that engine without major dramas thanks to the advice I got from here, for example when the oil pump wouldn't prime.
That was a good find for the crank people. The crank was one of the items that had me worried about my upcoming Bomber engine rebuild. Have kept a note of those people to use later, and what a decent price as well. By the way, Pete has done quite a few of my clocks now and does a first class job at a reasonable price. I have been very pleased with his work (have I done enough for my 10% yet Pete). ;D ;D
« Last Edit: December 14, 2017, 07:25:11 AM by royhall »
Current bikes:
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Honda CB350F in Candy Bacchus Olive
Honda CB750F2 in Candy Apple Red
Triumph Trident 660 in Black/White
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Honda CB450K0 Black Bomber
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Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #57 on: December 22, 2017, 04:59:09 PM »
The crank came back safely, they even tied the bearings so all the rollers haven't fallen out (yet).

The carb rubbers are back from Ashley, they no longer feel like they are metal, cheers for doing that, Ash. I recognised the parcel tape straight away! Pete has been in touch about my gauges, just use the best internals with the steel case, Pete, cheers.

Finally I got a note from Parcefarce to say my seat is in the UK, arrived from Vietnam, and they'd like some money please. Less than I expected, just plus VAT and extortion fee, but who am I to argue?

There will now be a hiatus, as January is my busiest month work wise, hopefully I will be back in the garage in February.

1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline MrDavo

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #58 on: December 29, 2017, 03:12:01 PM »
First of all here's what I started with, A later seat but with early tank and side panels, which I definitely wanted to keep. The seat is going up for sale if anyone needs one, by the way, I'll stick an ad up when I get around to it.



A box arrived in the snows from a big white van late yesterday, my seat
 here at last from vietnam!

Here it is once I realised the missing strap was bolted to its mounts, but in the undertray for safe transit.  :-[





You can see on the chainguard the tasteful metallic purple the whole bike once was. probably when it got the cowhorns (Don't forget to look for the bars, James  :) . BTW those are the original Decarbon shocks (must  look for stickers again), I wonder if I can swap them with the CB750K1 (which wears replicas) for shows?
 
The imitiation alligators they use in Vietnam these days aren't as mature as the one they used to make James's patana 1968 seat, maybe it'll wear in with use.



While I was typing this, my doorbell rang, there was was a DHL van outside. It was my clocks back from Peter, excellent.  :) The steel tacho is the one that's refurbished, with no sign of my bodged paint job and a replated base.



I was worried I'd now need the other base doing, but as it seems to be newish old stock, the speedo finish looks fine with it, other than a bit of cable rub, that may well be hidden by whatever cable has done it, we'll see. These are mounted by finger, no rubbers or bolts, I just had to see.





All looks splendid, thanks Peter!



He also sent two stainless bases as I hadn't got a matching pair, thanks.


« Last Edit: September 24, 2018, 04:48:17 PM by MrDavo »
1969 Honda CL450 'Scrambler'
1974 Kawasaki Z1A
2005 Harley XL1200R Sportster
1985 Porsche 911 3.2 Carrera Sport
1978 VW Bay Window camper van

Offline JamesH

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Re: 1969 CL450 Restoration
« Reply #59 on: December 29, 2017, 04:21:15 PM »
Making good progress there well done mate. The bars are on a 500/4 that’s at my mate Andy’s place for storage - I’ve asked him to measure them so as soon as I know I’ll drop you a pm...

 

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