Author Topic: The Black Knight...Dialed in and ready to ride.  (Read 2676 times)

Offline Trigger

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #30 on: November 27, 2018, 07:22:22 AM »
Interesting large amounts of Hondabond. It only needs to be a light smear on the parts of the cases that need sealing from oil to the outside world not, all the mating surfaces  ;) Hondabond is a sealant and it looks like you have tried to create a gasket with letting it go off before closing the cases :o This could give you problems very soon from string blocking the oil strainer and jets.

Offline SteveD CB500K0

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #31 on: November 27, 2018, 07:37:14 AM »
On a lighter note, I notice that you use the word "gudgeon" pin - I would have expected "wrist" pin?
Or are you self-censoring  8)

On the .net site, I once started a "divided by a common language" thread. It was astonishing how quickly it filled up.
I might go and see if I can find it...

Also, we seem to be better off here as most of us don't need licence "tags" or annual MOT tests any more.

Steve
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Offline taysidedragon

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #32 on: November 27, 2018, 09:50:31 AM »
Looking good so far Eric. 👍
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1977 CB400F

Offline Seabeowner

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #33 on: November 27, 2018, 10:03:24 AM »
Wow what a lot of great pics.

"New rings gapped at 0.040"  Is that 0.040 in. correct, seems large? Or is that 0.4mm, 0.016"?
« Last Edit: November 27, 2018, 11:55:44 AM by Seabeowner »
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Offline Laverda120

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #34 on: November 27, 2018, 11:34:13 AM »
Looking good Eric. You obviously don't sleep for long each day at the speed you are going! Are you going to repaint the frame as part of the build?

Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #35 on: November 27, 2018, 12:25:57 PM »
Interesting large amounts of Hondabond. It only needs to be a light smear on the parts of the cases that need sealing from oil to the outside world not, all the mating surfaces  ;) Hondabond is a sealant and it looks like you have tried to create a gasket with letting it go off before closing the cases :o This could give you problems very soon from string blocking the oil strainer and jets.

Oh I dont know about all that, Sir.  Im definitley not a pro engine builder.  But, thank you for the good info.

Time will tell. 

Its pretty thin and you can see per the photo virtually nothing squeezed out upon torquing to specs.

Just following the recommendation as per the Official Honda workshop manual. 

Occasionally I have a bit of trouble interpreting exactly what they are meaning.



« Last Edit: November 27, 2018, 12:27:47 PM by trek97 »

Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #36 on: November 27, 2018, 12:41:21 PM »
On a lighter note, I notice that you use the word "gudgeon" pin - I would have expected "wrist" pin?
Or are you self-censoring  8)

On the .net site, I once started a "divided by a common language" thread. It was astonishing how quickly it filled up.
I might go and see if I can find it...

Also, we seem to be better off here as most of us don't need licence "tags" or annual MOT tests any more.

Steve

haha nope here in my garage its a "gudgeon" pin.

Also nice that you dont need tags or tests. 

Here individual states have their own sets of rules.  And all of them seem to differ.

In some States if a vehicle is more than 25 years old it doesn't need a Title. 

In Illinois doesn't matter what it is.  If it ever had a VIN # then it has to have the original Title to get license tags for the street.  There are other types of Titles available but they are $$$$ and take up to 3 years to receive. 

So its just easier and cheaper to buy a frame w a Title.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2018, 12:43:05 PM by trek97 »

Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #37 on: November 27, 2018, 12:56:40 PM »
Wow what a lot of great pics.

"New rings gapped at 0.040"  Is that 0.040 in. correct, seems large? Or is that 0.4mm, 0.016"?

Looking good so far Eric. 👍

Looking good Eric. You obviously don't sleep for long each day at the speed you are going! Are you going to repaint the frame as part of the build?

Thanks so much everyone.   :)

Honda assembly standard on ring end gap is 0.15 - 0.35,  Mine is 0.254. Honda device limit is 0.70.  As best as my bifocals can see it.  Ha

Also yea this was over a couple weeks time.  And we have no kids in the house.  So that makes it easier to find spare time.

Also, Yes I sleep a lot.  My wife says too much napping.  haha

Im getting really close to having this thread caught up to where Im sitting presently.  Ill try to get it caught up in real time tonight.

Gotta run to my "Real Job" now.  Ugh! 

Offline Oddjob

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #38 on: November 27, 2018, 01:43:14 PM »
Am I reading this correctly?

You swapped crankcases and used the same shell bearings from the old case to transfer into the new case? I can see you using plastiguage but is that on the new case or the old one. You'd be very very lucky to find 2 different sets of cases with the exact same bore for the crank to sit in.

Also wondering why when you had the cases fully dismantled and cleaned up you didn't spray them before you started to assemble the engine?
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Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #39 on: November 27, 2018, 02:30:44 PM »
Am I reading this correctly?

You swapped crankcases and used the same shell bearings from the old case to transfer into the new case? I can see you using plastiguage but is that on the new case or the old one. You'd be very very lucky to find 2 different sets of cases with the exact same bore for the crank to sit in.

Also wondering why when you had the cases fully dismantled and cleaned up you didn't spray them before you started to assemble the engine?

Yup, I believe the reason they make different thickness bearings available for purchase.  If they had been outside of spec I would have replaced them with the size necessary to bring it back to proper spec.  Either due to wear, utilizing original case or replacing the case, as I did.  I was happy to find All the bearings plastigauged the same, within spec. 

And yeah, to paint the major components individually it would have required a bunch of extra work masking.  The painted covers (clutch, alternator, etc.  I just fit loosely without gaskets.  Then removed and wiped gasket surfaces w lacquer thinner and a paper towel to clean before gasket installation.

Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2018, 02:40:07 PM »
And if they had been too tight, I could’ve taken the case to be bored to fit at a machine shop.  Or just ended up getting the broken kickstart support pillar welded and fixed in the original case.

As it is , it worked out so I’m a happy camper
« Last Edit: November 27, 2018, 06:05:51 PM by trek97 »

Offline Oddjob

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #41 on: November 27, 2018, 10:32:11 PM »
Did you compare the crankcase markings on both cases? they should be on the back of the bottom crankcase and are the journal sizes as marked and measured by Honda when it was new.

It's quite easy to get a false reading from Plastigauge IMO, too much torque, too little torque and you get a different result. 
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Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #42 on: November 28, 2018, 12:30:19 AM »
Did you compare the crankcase markings on both cases? they should be on the back of the bottom crankcase and are the journal sizes as marked and measured by Honda when it was new.

It's quite easy to get a false reading from Plastigauge IMO, too much torque, too little torque and you get a different result.

Wow thanks, I had no idea.  But I will see what I can find.

How have you measured them for rebuild or replacement if not trusting plastigauge to be accurate, enough?

"Too much or too little torque"?  Im Not exactly sure why someone would purposefully set up the torque wrench wrong when checking bearings w plastigauge?  But this is your reasoning not mine.

Again, Im just using Hondas preferred technique as per manual.

Stamped Or do you mean hand written numbers?  If so, long long gone. haha  :P

Ill look through my pics.  Maybe caught them by random chance.

This kind of info is why I like these forums.  And why I was excited to join this U.K. forum, 

Just wishing I knew about it earlier.  As there is more knowledge on the 400F here than I found in the States.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2018, 03:39:21 AM by trek97 »

Offline Deano400

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #43 on: November 28, 2018, 08:34:11 AM »
Hi trek97.
I think this is what you are looking.

Offline trek97

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Re: 75 CB400four, Black Knight, The good, bad and ugly.
« Reply #44 on: November 28, 2018, 11:58:40 AM »
Hi trek97.
I think this is what you are looking.

Thank you sir.  And yes I will check them out.   8)