1967 CB450K0 Black Bomber Rebuild - By Royhall

[Rozabikes Tim]

Credit to you Roy but seeing your other work and the attention to detail you always have, I am not surprised by the end result!!

[MrDavo]

Lovely job Roy, as expected.

I was intrigued by the CB450 long before I’d ever seen one. A a teenager, once I’d got an interest in bikes, I’d borrowed a couple of service manuals from the local library. One was for the CB450, I was intrigued by torsion bars for some reason.

I always thought the early CB450  tanks were fugly, they looked upside down and back to front to me, but that’s why the yanks had to invent the CL version. Which reminds me, if you see a series on Sky called ‘Your Honour’ the first episode features a cafe racer built from a CL450 as far as I can see.

[royhall]

I had another look at the timing over the weekend. The ignition instructions were explicit about not setting the timing with a strobe and to do it statically with a light. After that it can be checked for advance with a strobe but not adjusted with the engine running for fear of losing the earth and wrecking the capacitors. So that's what I did. I double checked the static timing and it was good both sides. So I strobed it and revved the engine to give maximum advance which was right between the marks both sides.

Now the strange bit, firstly on tick over the advance does not drop back fully, probably slightly off springs on the advancer. But that does not appear to affect starting or running. Secondly, it was running really well and idling at 1000rpm perfectly until I unclipped the strobe from the HT lead at which point it immediately fouled a plug? I changed the plug for a new one and its running fine again. Can anybody explain what happened there, really weird.

[royhall]

I had a reply back from DVLA about the V5C. They wanted more information as the registration has not been active for so long. If they had bothered to look at the information I had already sent them it was all there. No wonder government departments are so rubbish, bloody frustrating but I guess that same information has to be on one of their forms. This is what they sent (a pre-printed form complete with spelling mistakes):

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I may have it on the road by Christmas in time for the next lockdown.

[Laverda Dave]

I've just begun this process myself Roy for the BIL's Z400J.

I think I have a world of pain to come given your example!

Dave

[MrDavo]

I would argue that this is the sort of thing they mean by a rebuild, its certainly not a 1994 Toyota Previa any more. A man from Total Headturners tried to sell this to me at the NEC a couple of years ago when I was looking at an Alfa Romeo that they had. How I laughed.



I notice that the DVLA require a 'Built Up Vehicle Report' for what they call a rebuild. I've never seen one, but I'm sure it doesn't apply to a restoration like Roy's but would be appropriate for Thunderbird 2 there. More on the line of 'does it have adequate brakes?', 'is it held together with sellotape /cable ties?' etc

[Bryanj]

Used to be called an engineers report, i got enough verbiage after the name to do one

[royhall]

This is the one they sent me. I answered no to all three questions about alterations and didn't send back the report. Will wait and see what happens, probably VMCC dating certificate required next.

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[MCTID]

Regarding the V627/1....never seen this before as I have never completed and registered a Project so far.....but that's another story......but who do they consider 'Competent and capable' of completing the Form.....and will they accept the word of the person completing it or not....and what's next and who arbitrates if they don't ?

It's a typical badly thought out Form IMHO...... it's loosely supposed to cover 'all eventualities' yet 90% of it will often be N/A......that wonderful term which Bureaucrats always hate. The fact that there is so little space to explain particular aspects next to the particular question and the fact that everything 'unusual' is expected to be thrown in at the end just begs for confusion and delays.....and always makes more work for Departments like the DVLA (maybe that's why they do it ) ?

I spent many years developing Forms in my career, and it isn't easy I'll admit, but the best check is to ask a group of people with different backgrounds to try and fill the Form in.......it's astonishing how 6 different people interpret a sentence with 6 different outcomes ! It certainly focuses your mind on how to ask the right questions and the best way to ask them !

I also dealt with many kinds of 'Certificates of Conformity' where a production run of scores of Castings or Forgings, or hundreds of metres of steel bar or plate were produced from one batch of molten metal and the Manufacturer was 'Certifying' that the components which you had bought had been tested and found to comply with the Specified Requirements. These C of C's were a Legal Document and falsifying them could lead to prosecution if it was found to be fraudulent. Companies who practised such falsifications soon went out of business.

The other problem with Forms like the V627/1 is that they take no account of the integrity of the person completing it. If a Professional issues a Structural Survey or a Medical Diagnosis they always note their Qualifications which adds weight to their findings, and gives confidence to the reader.

You don't need to be a qualified Doctor or a Professor of Chemistry to complete a Form like the V627/1, but maybe having to provide some background of who you are, how long you have lived at your address (or previous addresses) whether you have done this exercise before and the fact that you agree and accept that you could be prosecuted for providing false information and/or prohibited from making further applications in future if you knowingly provide false information would take the onus off the DVLA and putting it firmly on the Applicant would probably make the process easier as it would prevent fraudulent applications....which has to be the whole point of this unwieldy system.   

Just my slant on things having now seen the V627/1 Form, which If I was a Director at DVLA, I'd be investigating the % of Applications which are rejected, and providing some proper training to the person(s) drafting such Forms !

[AshimotoK0]

The joke is that my Bomber is literally a totally bitsa . I just had a frame to start and lots and lots  of boxes of bits from other bikes probably ....but it was on the DVLA computer register and I luckily  had an old V5 from the late 70's with the tear off slip still attached,  so I sent it off to DVLA and after about 2 weeks they sent me a V5C, no questions, no photos, no dating cert. etc

[royhall]

Don't forget Ash I also had a V5 which they have got. I think I shouldn't have been honest about the engine number change and done that later after the V5C had arrived. It will get there in the end, although I had far less hassle registering two bikes from abroad. 1 from Holland and one from USA, just sailed through.

[AshimotoK0]

Don't forget Ash I also had a V5 which they have got. I think I shouldn't have been honest about the engine number change and done that later after the V5C had arrived. It will get there in the end, although I had far less hassle registering two bikes from abroad. 1 from Holland and one from USA, just sailed through.

Yes I guess I will have to tell them about my engine number change sometime ... so they may ask me for a receipt for the replacement  ...hopefully no more. Good thing about Bombers is the engine & frame numbers are miles apart so you are not scratting to find a set cases 'in range'
Problem is ...you can phone DVLA ne time  and they bend over back wards to help you  .. then you phone another time and you get a total pen-pushing numpty who it seems puts ever obstacle in your way to prevent you getting a V5C. The latter  was my experience with the CB250G5

[royhall]

Yes they wanted a receipt for the new engine. I told them it's only the cases changed and the rest of the engine is original. I sent them pictures of the replacement cases. That should confuse them no end, original engine but the numbers changed. Deerrrr.

[AshimotoK0]

Yes they wanted a receipt for the new engine. I told them it's only the cases changed and the rest of the engine is original. I sent them pictures of the replacement cases. That should confuse them no end, original engine but the numbers changed. Deerrrr.

I think I will get my bike dealer mate to 'sell' me my engine 

[royhall]

No signs of DVLA getting me legal yet. I suppose no news is good news, at least it's not been rejected out of hand.