MOT Exempt - 'Substantially Modified'

[philward]

Question for you ex MOT testers. Just doing the historical vehicle annual taxing on the CR750 Reprica and noticed that you have to sign a declaration to say the the bike has not been 'Substantially Modified'. Read the notes and couldn't really work out what it means to bikes - ie, is my CR considered 'Substantially Modified'.
Any info much appreciated as I may/may not need to MOT the bike
Phil

[Nurse Julie]

I will post a link in a minute Phil but I would say yours doesn't qualify anywhere near the substantially modified regs, so you will be ok saying No to the declaration

[Nurse Julie]

Section 3. First part excludes biked, 2nd part includes bike as relevant to all vehicles.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/historic-classic-vehicles-mot-exemption-criteria/historic-classic-vehicles-mot-exemption-criteria#substantial-changes-criteria

Also this Phil
However, in general, if the changes have been made to improve safety, are using replacement parts of the same design as original, or using the same basic engine design, then these are not considered substantial changes. These include:
Changes made to preserve the vehicle, which in all cases must be when original type parts are no longer reasonably available;
Changes of a type i.e. a bodyshell with the same design as the original made when vehicles of the type were in production;
Changes to axles and running gear to improve efficiency, safety or environmental performance

[Moorey]

This was in Classic Bike Guide.
The ‘substantially modified’ category has seen the authorities abandon an original eight-point scheme which would have categorised different components, such as engines, frames, suspension and brakes as changes that affected the vehicle’s historic age for a simpler arrangement. This followed concerns that vehicles that had upgraded brakes or better engines might fall foul of the regulations. Instead, ‘substantially modified’ will now mean a vehicle that has a power to weight ratio of more than 15 per cent in excess of its original design, unless such a modification took place before 1988
But I can not find any official doc referring to it. I don't think the Dov know what to do about bikes and are leaving it open to possible change in the future if need be.

[Nurse Julie]

I think you are correct Chris. This was all outlined in a 'draft' document which has still not been signed off or whatever they do. I think HM Gov have other more pressing things on their minds that clarifying our little queries 🙄🙄🙄🙄

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/670431/vehicles-of-historical-interest-substantial-change-guidance.pdf

[philward]

Thanks Julie and Chris - I thought it was all a little vague for motorcycles but that pretty much clears it up for me

[Moorey]

I think you are correct Chris. This was all outlined in a 'draft' document which has still not been signed off or whatever they do. I think HM Gov have other more pressing things on their minds that clarifying our little queries 🙄🙄🙄🙄

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/670431/vehicles-of-historical-interest-substantial-change-guidance.pdf

I wonder what that might be. No doubt something to do with saving their own arses.

[philward]

I think you are correct Chris. This was all outlined in a 'draft' document which has still not been signed off or whatever they do. I think HM Gov have other more pressing things on their minds that clarifying our little queries 🙄🙄🙄🙄

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/670431/vehicles-of-historical-interest-substantial-change-guidance.pdf

What about this - https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/kitconverted-vehicles - alters the appearance?

[Trigger]

I think you are correct Chris. This was all outlined in a 'draft' document which has still not been signed off or whatever they do. I think HM Gov have other more pressing things on their minds that clarifying our little queries 🙄🙄🙄🙄

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/670431/vehicles-of-historical-interest-substantial-change-guidance.pdf

What about this - https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/kitconverted-vehicles - alters the appearance?

You old boys worry too much. If you have a original unmodified frame then it does not count as a kit conversion on a bike 

[Nurse Julie]

A kit vehicle definition is :
A kit-built vehicle is one where all the parts are supplied new by the manufacturer.

So that's not relevant to your bike either Phil.

A kit-converted vehicle has had:
a kit of new parts added to an existing vehicle, or
old parts added to a new kit
The general appearance of the vehicle will change because of the kit.

[Trigger]

Unless you have a CR hard tail 

[Mike on a bike]

So my bike has no modification to the engine and the suspension has been removed so less parts to go wrong, so can this be classed for MOT exemption? 

[Nurse Julie]

Unless you can prove it was all done over 30 years ago, I would say yours has been substantially modified and looks like it should be on a Q plate therefore needs yearly MOT's still. I would like to be proved wrong though.

[Trigger]

So my bike has no modification to the engine and the suspension has been removed so less parts to go wrong, so can this be classed for MOT exemption? 

The only CB750 parts you have there is the, engine, carbs, front wheel, fork lowers and rear wheel hub. That is a custom built frame and never had any suspension fitted, to be removed 

[Mike on a bike]

Unless you can prove it was all done over 30 years ago, I would say yours has been substantially modified and looks like it should be on a Q plate therefore needs yearly MOT's still. I would like to be proved wrong though.

It is registered as a 1976 so no Q plate.