Author Topic: genuine parts  (Read 450 times)

Offline rosco

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genuine parts
« on: February 05, 2020, 12:35:14 PM »
Hi All   i have just bought some carb clamps to airbox (4 ) for my cb400 f2 they are Black in colour  They are marked as genuine parts   But another label states Made In India   My question is pre 1978 did Honda source supplies from either China  Taiwan or India  The guy i bought these from is adamant they are genuine  But my thoughts were back in the day all parts were Made In Japan I don't Know if modern type bikes are using foreign sorted parts ???  All your thoughts appreciated   Cheers  Ross

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2020, 01:16:02 PM »
A lot of genuine Honda parts, supplied in genuine Honda parts bags, that we buy and use ourselves are made in Taiwan, the Phillipines and China, India etc. I'm not sure where they were manufactured back in the day though. Your seller may well be correct though, they may well be Genuine Honda (ie, they fit lots of models) but that must not be confused with Original parts, which are specific only to, in this case the 400/4. They are most probably a superseded part. Ash will confirm this I'm sure but the Original Honda 400/4 clamps were Drab Olive Green passivate, not black.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 01:20:33 PM by Nurse Julie »
Im a Nurse, trust me, this won't hurt.....much !!!

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Offline orcadian

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2020, 01:18:39 PM »
According to Mr Silver, the original bright zinc bands have a supercession number which does come in black - or perhaps very dark olive drab.  All of the ones I’ve removed from unmolested bikes have been bright zinc plated, so I have replated ones worth doing - not mangled and good threads.  There were originally different part numbers for carb to stub and carb to air-box but they now appear the same.  Additionally the originals were simple flat hoops whereas the new ones have a lip at each edge of the band.

Ian

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2020, 01:22:13 PM »
According to Mr Silver, the original bright zinc bands have a supercession number which does come in black - or perhaps very dark olive drab.  All of the ones I’ve removed from unmolested bikes have been bright zinc plated, so I have replated ones worth doing - not mangled and good threads.  There were originally different part numbers for carb to stub and carb to air-box but they now appear the same.  Additionally the originals were simple flat hoops whereas the new ones have a lip at each edge of the band.

Ian
Do you think Ian that the ones you have found on unmolested bikes may well have been BZP under the dark drab olive passivate and the passivate has worn off, as it does.
Im a Nurse, trust me, this won't hurt.....much !!!

LINK TO MY CB400/4 ENGINE STRIP / ASSESSMENT AND REBUILD...NOW COMPLETE
http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,14049.msg112691/topicseen.html#new

Offline orcadian

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2020, 01:58:34 PM »
Hi Julie,
You could certainly be right if the drab passivate disappears naturally from everywhere over time as I found no evidence of it, not even lurking in the hidden corners of the clips near the nut.  We know that the yellow disappears, I hope Ash has the answer.  Might have to get some drab passivate from Gateros next time I order!

Ian


Offline Trigger

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2020, 02:47:14 PM »
You can just make out the remains of the olive on this original one  ;)



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Offline orcadian

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2020, 04:30:25 PM »
Just got a couple of poor pictures from my good friend Keith in Hull who bought LUG 14P brand new and these pics were taken very early on - he sold it and went working in Saudi in ‘77

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I’ll leave you good folk to decide what finish is on the clips,
Ian

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« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 04:39:34 PM by orcadian »

Offline awrawr

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2020, 10:23:14 PM »
I've owned mine since 1980 when it had bzp clips. I bought four new genuine honda replacements from dss last year as part of a major restoration and was surprised but not bothered when they turned up in a shade of very dark green.

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2020, 07:01:26 AM »
Well I always thought they were silver BZP but after this post I could be wrong. And it's over to kettle738 (Mick)  to see if he has any pics of the carb clamps of the totally unmolested low miler he bought a few years back.

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,21083.0.html

I know that the DS ones are Gnuine Honda but made in India and are black/very drak olive drab passivate. They are not flat but turned over edge type, as Ian described.

On a different bike .. the CB750K0 the carb clamps were chromed and the airbox ones were BZP silver plated ??
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline Andrew-S

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2020, 11:00:59 AM »
Well I always thought they were silver BZP but after this post I could be wrong. And it's over to kettle738 (Mick)  to see if he has any pics of the carb clamps of the totally unmolested low miler he bought a few years back.

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,21083.0.html

I know that the DS ones are Gnuine Honda but made in India and are black/very drak olive drab passivate. They are not flat but turned over edge type, as Ian described.

On a different bike .. the CB750K0 the carb clamps were chromed and the airbox ones were BZP silver plated ??

Hi Ash,

Here's a photo (pre-clean up) of my 11/70 20k survivor K1 and the clamps seem to be plated:



Bikes: 1970 US CB750 K1 and a UK 1976 Z900 A4
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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2020, 11:06:53 AM »
Well I always thought they were silver BZP but after this post I could be wrong. And it's over to kettle738 (Mick)  to see if he has any pics of the carb clamps of the totally unmolested low miler he bought a few years back.

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,21083.0.html

I know that the DS ones are Gnuine Honda but made in India and are black/very drak olive drab passivate. They are not flat but turned over edge type, as Ian described.

On a different bike .. the CB750K0 the carb clamps were chromed and the airbox ones were BZP silver plated ??

Hi Ash,

Here's a photo (pre-clean up) of my 11/70 20k survivor K1 and the clamps seem to be plated:

Yea but on the sandcast early K0 it was deffo a mix of BZP and a rather dull chrome . .  This was also confirmed on the sandcastonly forum. But not sure about late K0s and K1s .. James may know.
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline JamesH

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2020, 12:15:10 PM »
BZP/clear passivate on Diecast K0 from my experience.

Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2020, 02:19:46 PM »
BZP/clear passivate on Diecast K0 from my experience.


This is what MarkB  ChrisR  said on SOOC and my 10/69 KO was the same  James



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Honda CB750 Sandcast »The Restoration Shop »Chrome - Anodizing and Other Metal Finish Procedures»Please Help Me Check My Chrome Plating List

Please Help Me Check My Chrome Plating List

 markb ·  36 ·  6764

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markbHero Member

on: December 01, 2011, 02:40:33 PM

I’m going through my parts to get everything ready for plating for #97.  Can I get you experts to scrutinize this list and make sure I have everything correct for chrome?  I don’t need all of these pieces chromed but I figured I might as well make a complete check list.

Here's my edited list (4/28/15):

Seat strap clips and screws
Front brake hose bracket
Point cover
Clutch adjusting cover
Starting motor cover
Gear shift arm and bolt
Kick starter joint
Kick starter arm and bolt
Mirrors & nuts
Handlebar
Front fender & stays
Rear fender
Fuel cap & check
Mufflers
Rear Brake Arm
Rear Brake Pedal
Chain Adjusters
Front & Rear Rims
Side Grip
Rear Shock Covers & Springs
Brackets & Bottom Plates for Tach & Speedo
Headlight Rim & Retaining Ring
Turn signal bases
Fork boot bottom collar
Fork cap bolts
Steering stem nut & washer
Shafts & washers for turn signals on headlight bucket
Tail light base & number plate bracket
Ignition switch washer
Cap nuts and washer for top rear shocks
All bolts, washers & nuts for the handle bar clamps & top bridge
Brake line screws for banjo ends (before VIN 2720)
Six bolts for brake disc
Front fender stay mounting oval head screws
Swing arm pivot bolt and self locking nut
Bolts, washers & nuts for mounting turn signal bases on stems
Lower shock mounting bolts
Kick starter knuckle pin
Clutch & brake lever pivot bolts & nuts
Exhaust pipe joints
Exhaust pipe flanges
Rear axle, washer & nut
Clamps & screws for rubbers from head to carbs (carbs to air box zinc)
Horn
Caliper Adjusting Spring
So by default I believe this means that everything else that's shiny and not aluminum is zinc plated.  Thanks for taking the time to check this out.  Maybe this will be helpful for someone else (whose anal too).

« Last Edit: April 28, 2015, 01:37:24 PM by markb »


CB750faces.com (Lecram)Full Member 

Reply #1 on: December 01, 2011, 04:22:40 PM

Hi Mark,

I think that your oil tank cap is stainless steel. It is at the later models (K0 - K2), but probably also for the sandcast. You can polish that cap with alu polish


Steve SwanHero Member 

Reply #2 on: December 01, 2011, 09:45:36 PM

Yes also; I've only seen stainless oil caps


markbHero Member

Reply #3 on: December 02, 2011, 09:44:17 AM

This is why I talk to you guys.   That makes sense, I'll double check mine tonight.  I was wondering what I was going to do about the dip stick.  I'll update my list accordingly.


CB750faces.com (Lecram)Full Member 

Reply #4 on: December 02, 2011, 04:18:08 PM

This is my K2 cap after polishing


kpAdministratorHero Member

Reply #5 on: December 02, 2011, 04:36:17 PM

Hi Mark
Lower shock mounting bolts - Yes
Kick starter knuckle pin - Yes
Kick starter arm bolt, 8x28 - Yes
Clutch & brake lever pivot bolts & nuts - Yes but I would buy new
Front axle & nut - No Zinc Plated as far as I know
Exhaust pipe joints - Yes
Exhaust pipe flanges - Yes Mine are
Rear axle, washer & nut (on head of axle only?) Yes but I think the whole shaft is also chrome plated and maybe resized. That is a good topic as I really can't say with this
Some of the smaller items I tend to buy NOS as the finish with re-chromed stuff is too damn good. Each to their own though
AND the carb clamps but these are satin chrome I think


markbHero Member

Reply #6 on: December 02, 2011, 06:14:09 PM

Marcel,
That looks great.  It looks like chrome doesn't it.
KP,
Thanks for the comprehensive answer.  I agree it's better to buy the little stuff too but also because it's cheaper than having it plated.  It's even true with some of the bigger items.  For example, I've found it's cheaper to buy handlebars than have them replated.  One little thing I'll have to rechrome is the oil bolts obviously because they're not available in chrome.  They're going to look great with your beautiful hoses.  


Steve SwanHero Member 

Reply #7 on: December 02, 2011, 07:08:57 PM

Re:  Plated finishes for intake rubber manifolds, airbox intake horns and bolts.  

Every CB750 i have seen, 69-onward, the 8 clamps for the rubber intake manifolds have a different plated finish than the 4 clamps for the airbox intake horns.

The manifold clamps appear to have a fairly bright chrome satin sheen to an almost nearly shiny finish.  

The airbox clamps appear much less shiny than the manifold clamps.

Manifold clamps appear to be chrome plated, am sure steel not polished and probably no copper base, perhaps this gives the satin sheen appearance.

Airbox clamps appear dull in contrast to the 8 clamps, appears zinc.

If my memory serves me correctly, seems the manifold clamps are a different size than the airbox clamps.  Cannot remember if there's different pns for these clamps, seem to think there is...... 

I've also noticed finishes on all bolts are not the same; range from a satin to a shiny.  Most have a satin sheen, but there are others that are shiny.  Larger bolts in more prominent places are more shiny, smaller bolts less shiny.

« Last Edit: December 02, 2011, 07:10:46 PM by Steve Swan »


hondasanAdministratorSr. Member

Reply #8 on: December 03, 2011, 02:36:18 PM

The 8 manifold clamps are chrome - sometimes full chrome, sometimes less so. The 4 airbox rubber clamps are bzp.
Parts list gives different part numbers for these, presumably due to the different finish. My parts list also shows that the chrome clamps (300 middle number) supercede to to the same part number (230 middle number) as the bzp airbox ones. Presumably therefore these are the same size.
Re-chrome of the original manifold clamps can be a real problem if they are in poor condition - polishers tend to get carried away and destroy them, or at very best return them with custom chrome finish. Maybe the bzp ones could be stripped and then re finished in chrome if original chrome ones missing, or too far gone to restore? 
Cheers - Chris R.


markbHero Member

Reply #9 on: December 05, 2011, 08:33:57 AM

I observed the same thing with the part numbers.  Excellent information.  My manifold clamps may be in good enough condition to rechrome without over doing it but I like your idea of using the -230- clamps and chroming them if need be.  It appears that the -230- clamps are available from Honda.  By the way, bzp is zinc plate?


WayneAdministratorHero Member

Reply #10 on: December 05, 2011, 11:27:00 AM

I beleive BZP is Bright Zinc Plating Mark. All of my clamps were rotted so I'll be watching thsione closely as well.


markbHero Member

Reply #11 on: December 06, 2011, 01:36:21 PM

Thanks for all the input guys.  I've edited my list to reflect everyone's comments.  This should be a pretty complete list of everything I need to rechrome or buy.  Once I get that all sorted out I'll go through the zinc.


markbHero Member

Reply #12 on: December 14, 2011, 09:52:24 AM

I think I missed an item.  Is the swing arm (rear fork) pivot bolt chrome too?  One more question, has anyone ever seen an "8" bolt chromed?


Joe KSr. Member

Reply #13 on: December 14, 2011, 09:53:03 PM

As far as I know, the pivot swing arm bolt is chrome and the nut on the opposite side.  I think all of the "8" bolts are anodized, but not positive.  I purchased the set from Yamiya and they are still new.  I chromed several "8" bolts last summer and the chrome covered up the "8" on the bolt, so I wouldn't advise to do it.  

Joe K.


Steve SwanHero Member 

Reply #14 on: December 15, 2011, 07:53:47 PM

I have only have seen chrome on the swing arm shaft and nut.  I do not recall ever seeing any "8" bolt chrome plated; only zinc.


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“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2020, 02:24:43 PM »
Sorry for possibly the longest thread Hijack in the history of this site.Cant edit on my phone !!  :-[
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

Offline AshimotoK0

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Re: genuine parts
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2020, 06:54:07 PM »
Back to original CB400F question and asked a few people and pretty certain that original carb clamps were clear passivate (bluish) and not yellow chromate.
“Alright friends, you have seen the heavy groups, now you will see morning maniac music. Believe me, yeah. It’s a new dawn.” Grace Slick, Woodstock '69 .. In the year of the Sandcast.

 

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