Author Topic: 1977 400F2 first restore project  (Read 22569 times)

Online McCabe-Thiele (Ted)

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2020, 10:10:11 AM »
Hmm, never thought about it Mac... tho’ this stolen from Wikipedia..

“ An impact wrench (also known as an impactor, impact gun, air wrench, air gun, rattle gun, torque gun, windy gun) is a socket wrench power tool designed to deliver high torque output with minimal exertion by the user, by storing energy in a rotating mass, then delivering it suddenly to the output shaft. It was invented by Robert H. Pott of Evansville, Indiana.”
[/quote
In that case we agree a rattle gun is a great tool - it removed all my clutch casing screws easily. Mine has two torque settings for tightening but it defaults to maximum when undoing anything. I only use the tightening mode for wheel nuts - always using a torque stick - they are a clever invention for impact drivers.
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Offline Bryanj

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2020, 08:38:09 PM »
Personally i wouldnt use a "rattle gun" on hillips screws only on nuts and bolts plus the odd spinning allen screw in bottom of fork leg.
I do have a 3/8 drive air impact gun from when i was in the trade but havent used it for years as i dont have a compressor

Online McCabe-Thiele (Ted)

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2020, 11:05:05 PM »
Personally i wouldnt use a "rattle gun" on hillips screws only on nuts and bolts plus the odd spinning allen screw in bottom of fork leg.
I do have a 3/8 drive air impact gun from when i was in the trade but havent used it for years as i dont have a compressor
The impact driver I use is a cordless electric one as is my impact screwdriver. Surprisingly the impact screwdriver is kinder on a Philips headed woodscrew than doing it by hand.  Cordless hand tools have really improved in the last decade. That said I would always tighten into alloy & steel by hand.
Honda CB500 K1 (new pit dug out ready)
Honda CB400 four super sport (first money pit)
Link to my full restoration http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,23291.0.html

Offline Lobo

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #18 on: October 15, 2020, 04:59:38 AM »
I find the same too; ie far less damage done to cross-heads, perhaps because you are able to apply a more effective ‘push’ force into the head.
Last week I got 8 x 50yo Phillips fastenings out of the Kombi door hinges. A lot of nail biting work, the beauty of the cordless tool being it’s easy of use, working forward / rev and so on, lots of penetrating oil etc. I sincerely doubt any other tool would have been as effective.

That said, and one for the smart folk; given you can undo fastenings effortlessly with the wrist (rattle gun) (& wheel nuts would be the prime example)- does this imply less torque is being applied? And if so... how does that work, is it simply the jarring motion mixed with torque? And if ultimately less torque, defacto less damage to the fastening?

And agreed; tightening up small fastenings with the tool has gotta be a no-no.

Offline Andych

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #19 on: October 15, 2020, 07:19:08 AM »
That is why they make a 3/8" Impact tool (mine is a Ryobi) and its a nice match for my 1/2" drive 18v Impact wrench.
I believe both are a Pre-set max torque. 150 Ft lbs for the 3/8" and 300 Ft lbs for the 1/2". I never use them to "torque" up bolts but will spin them up close and then final check with a torque wrench.

The 3/" one with a set of JIS bits is the pefect tool for pulling apart old Japanese motorcycles :)
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Offline AndyD

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2020, 08:58:20 AM »
Hi,
Likewise I love the impact wrench for stubborn fixings.
Have an air one but not too convenient when working in the shed away from the garage so splashed out on an 18v DeWalt one and it's a beast.
Love using it but definitely not for smaller fixings or screws - found a 10v cordless impact driver pretty good for these and much less violent.
Important issue with the wrench is taking care and wearing gloves, glasses etc. as it will happily rip things loose and spin them or distribute loose bits.
Cheers,
Andy

Offline smoothoperator

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #21 on: October 15, 2020, 07:48:30 PM »
Again short on time today but a quick update. Found that the lower brake pipe was indeed blocked. Soaked in hot water and pushed a guitar string through and hey presto it's cleared. It's drying out on the radiator now. Will have time tomorrow to move forward with this. Meanwhile I am learning lot's about impact drivers, great stuff.
Steve
2017 Triumph Bonneville T100
1977 Honda 400 Four Restored April 2022

Offline Green1

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #22 on: October 15, 2020, 08:10:31 PM »
I love impact drivers brilliant tools in the right hands.
When the chippys at work get them out I cringe because they mash the heads or sheer them off screws and I have no chance of removing them after.
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Offline smoothoperator

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2020, 05:07:40 PM »
Front brake progress. Found that the upper brake line was also blocked, gave it the same treatment as the lower one to clear it out. Struggled to get fluid pumping down the lines and ended up using a technique from this site posted in 2009, using a syringe to pump fluid up which worked a treat. The brake worked but wasn't releasing its grip on the disc. Even got the brake light working. I know I shouldn't get so excited about that but it's early days. Next I squeezed on the brake lever and the brake pad started to move out and quickly the piston came out. The piston is badly corroded so I have ordered a new one with the seal.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/F2kYg3LwR8LoH5tU7
Steve
2017 Triumph Bonneville T100
1977 Honda 400 Four Restored April 2022

Offline smoothoperator

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2020, 08:25:39 PM »
Started cleaning the caliper and noticed some marks, sort of rivulets, under the paint and wondered if they were an issue, on removing the paint I don't think they are but have included an image if anyone has an opinion. Also included an image of the inside of the caliper and wondered if I should try to remove the hollow dowel to aid cleaning or is it best left in place. I gave it a bit of a tug with long nose pliers but it didn't want to yield. I think that its probably best left in place. New piston and seal arrived rapidly so is ready to fit once I have cleaned the caliper. Any recommendations on paint/prep welcome. Link to photos in previous post. Pretty much ready for a test ride once the front brake is sorted.
Steve
2017 Triumph Bonneville T100
1977 Honda 400 Four Restored April 2022

Offline robvangulik

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2020, 09:14:02 PM »
By those marks you probably mean the name of the manufacturer, TOKICO?
Leave the "dowel" where it is, I never removed one in over 40 years, it's only there to keep the pad from rotating.

Offline mike the bike

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2020, 09:38:38 PM »
I often use the finger over the bleed nipple trick.  On the road so it doesn't mess up my drive.
Where's that 10mm socket got to?

Offline smoothoperator

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2020, 05:21:17 PM »
Front brake still drawing air in from somewhere so currently on hold waiting for new washers and bleed nipple. I've also ordered a brake master cylinder service kit which will either go into the MC on the bike or the spare MC which I have now managed to take apart.

Petrol tank is currently enjoying a bath in 5 litres of Evaporust.

So spending some time looking around the bike and found that the clutch casing is broken, below the kick start. I've put in 3 images showing close up then moving out. It's a shame because it's the shiniest bit on the bike!

https://photos.app.goo.gl/LAxJuTkNkxzUVFPDA

Had a quick look for a replacement but the one I have found listed as CB 400 f is different. Am I getting the name right, clutch casing, clutch housing. Is a CB 400 f different to a CB 400 F super sport? Below a link to the one that is clearly different.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-CB350-4-CB350-Four-4-1972-1974-CB400-F-1975-77-Engine-Clutch-Cover-Casing/311983096875?hash=item48a3a4442b:g:cmsAAOSwnw9aBnky

Steve
2017 Triumph Bonneville T100
1977 Honda 400 Four Restored April 2022

Offline Nurse Julie

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2020, 05:26:39 PM »
That one is for a CB350/4 which is a different cover to which is fitted to the 400/4.Basically, the listing is wrong.
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Offline smoothoperator

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Re: 1977 400F2 first restore project
« Reply #29 on: October 22, 2020, 05:50:39 PM »
Thanks. I'll keep looking!
Steve
2017 Triumph Bonneville T100
1977 Honda 400 Four Restored April 2022

 

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