New Money Pit

[mickwinf]

a great restoration, very satisfying when they fire up first go!

[Seabeowner]

Great looking 350. Reminds me of the days when I had pictures of the same 250s on my wall and dreamed of being 16. But started on on C110.

[philward]

Just out of interest, I thought I'd post the cost of this build as I have just added up the receipts I have kept as part of the rebuild history (to help the kids sell the bikes when I snuff it - hopefully many years of riding away!).
The results supports our known fact that our money pit rebuilds nearly always cost more than the value. Just thought I'd post the results out of interest. Bear in mind all work was done myself except chrome and bodywork paint - ie, zinc plating, engine work, etc. (and chrome rims not replaced on this build) Here goes!
Purchase Price (DK)                            £1801
DS sourced Spares                               £790
Other sourced spares                            £886
Painter Labour (all Candy Paint)             £300
Chrome (from local expensive firm)        £925
Total                                                  £4702   
So (and I know this is nothing new and we all know this but worth putting an actual figure on it), my enjoyment of rebuilding a bike has cost about £1200 assuming I could get £3500 for it. 
As said previously in this thread, this will be my last 'classic build' - my next one will be an 80's build where there is less chrome and no candy paint so I can do it all myself - ie, still get the enjoyment of the build but less cost. Hope its of interest.
                                     

[AshimotoK0]

Know what you mean Phil.
Here is a prime example. I had to remind a friend that this was once his own bike !
https://www.classichondamotorcycles.co.uk/bikedetail.aspx?bike=5382

[philward]

Know what you mean Phil.
Here is a prime example. I had to remind a friend that this was once his own bike !
https://www.classichondamotorcycles.co.uk/bikedetail.aspx?bike=5382

Actually Ash, that reminds me, I didn't add the cost of the silencers you sorted for me! So thats around £5k build cost

[McCabe-Thiele (Ted)]

You are not alone Phil as has been said many times it's a labour of love not a money making exercise.
Mine does not have genuine rear dampers, exhaust system  or headlamp, not re-painted either.
My 400 that I rebuilt works out as follows.

Cost Price incl delivery               £2045
Parts, rebore, machining etc       £4639
CWC wheels & tyres                    £964

Total cost                                 £7648

I think I might struggle to recoup 70% of the above outlay.  - I do not think I will ever sell it.

[Laverda Dave]

It's fatal to add up the cost of a restoration, if you knew at the start how much it would cost how many of us would actually restore one?
I was lucky with my RSA as I paid £415 for it 22 years ago and used it as my daily rider. When I restored it I worked out it had cost me around £2750. I therefore did well as I'd got so much use and enjoyment from it riding it and then restoring it.
The 400/4 I restored for the o/h and she didn't like due to the weight  I lost out on big time although I did enjoy restoring it.
The silver lining about all our restorations though is that it's our hobby and the cost of the restoration is spread over a long period of time.

[philward]

Reference my similar issues to Ben's 350, I've eventually - after few hours off using a .35mm drill (that eventually broke!) and Ted's suggested wire brush wire method, cleared the slow running jet. Re-checked all passageways/jets and all clear. I also bought a cheap carb kit that included floats after comparing images with those on the advert to the one on DS site, they were the same - and they are rubbish! The pivot hole is 1mm too thick and the 'tang' on the float that prevents the float dropping too far (and the needle valve falling out) is missing. Bought the kit as it obviously included the slow running jet just in case I couldn't unblock the original. Didn't want to use a pattern jet but Honda item not available now - but luckily not needed.
Anyway, as the original brass 'bread bin' style floats had a small amount of petrol in them, I checked whether there was any obvious leaks, which there wasn't when submerged in jug of water. so drilled a 1mm hole in each float and allowed to drain over night on some kitchen roll. The petrol was stagnant and obviously been in there for some time. Soldered up the holes. Set floats at 19mm. Idle screws sync'ed and carbs sync'ed via cables. Timing/points re-checked and spot on. As per previous post, compression 160psi on both sides.
After re-assembling everything and starting the bike, the bike didn't need choke (cut out if choke applied) and generally running rough (sounds too rich to me). Also 'hangs' on returning to idle. Revs fine in middle and upper range. Although only warmed up and run in the garage, the plugs are sooty.
I'm wondering whether the floats are too high and causing rich running.
Also got a noisy tappet that I've checked as OK when stone cold (but going to check again). As these have the eccentric cams adjustment from the side of the cambox, I've adjusted the tappet in question while the engine is running and 'tap' only goes when the engine revs drop (clearly holding valve open). On rebuild, checked rockers visually and all looked ok - didn't check eccentric rocker shaft with a micrometer.
Thought I'd get your opinion before doing any further work (possible engine out again).
Thanks again in anticipation

[Oddjob]

You got the square type float Phil or the round type as there are different float heights for both.

[philward]

You got the square type float Phil or the round type as there are different float heights for both.

Square type Ken - info says 18.5mm to 19.5mm for square (later round type 23mm - 26mm I think). New square one's don't seem to be available even as pattern.

The Honda manual for the 350 quotes using a Honda tool that measures angle of the float not a  size in mm - info for the square type float comes from the web (various forums) - making me think about too higher float bowl level

[Oddjob]

I'd try the bubble test in a bowl of petrol as well Phil, petrol has an ability to gain access into places that water won't get into. Also check the height of both sides of the float in case it's twisted.

You sure the idle jet mixture screw opening isn't blocked?

[philward]

Both sides of float same (checked for twisting). Idle jets defo clear and engine revs rise in response to the air screw being screwed in and out

[Oddjob]

Can you try running it without the air filters?

[philward]

Yep, I did prior to last carb strip (last week) - carb pistons were responding to vacuum and moving up and down in mid and higher rev range. Is that what you were going to suggest?

[K2-K6]

Have you any vacuum readings from carb sync  ? If they are too high that would indicate that the slide is too low at tickover, to make it suck fuel in excess of target.

Things like air passage to slide volume/lift chamber, springs on slide if it has them etc will all have more effect in error at low rpm.

Possibly look at opening the static tickover rpm to lift it slightly, then make idle circuit richer to calm it down, that can give better "quenching" of throttle shut idle establishment.

Are the idle adjustment within decent range when you set the screws ?