Author Topic: CB400 Project  (Read 10979 times)

Offline beemsquar

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CB400 Project
« on: July 21, 2015, 11:40:07 AM »
Hi all, This is my first ever motorcycle build and I thought I would share the journey with the community as you have been very helpful with your advice and maybe it will help others doing similar projects.

I acquired the vehicle on the 03/07/15 from an old guy who had had it since 2012 and had started to do some jobs on it, (badly as it turns out).

It read 46000 on the odometer  and looked like this in the advert.

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I went to see the bike and it was already partly dismantled with what I think are constar wheels? off another bike.

I spent a good hour looking over it to see if the major bits were there, the guy started it up and it sounded OK, apart from blowing from the exhaust,  which he told me was because they weren't tightened up yet. He assured me that he had acquired a lot of parts and everything was there.  Knowing that I wanted a project bike that needed some TLC we haggled and I took her off his hands for £900.

I've set myself a loose budget of £1000 to rebuild and no more than 10 months to complete so I can ride it next summer.

I plan on doing most if not all the work myself , but might need some advice and guidance along the way.

 
 

Offline tom400f

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2015, 11:51:52 AM »
This is going to be interesting to follow. Good luck with her.
1978 CB400F2 Yellow
1995 VFR750FS Red
1997 VFR750FV Lapis Blue
2013 Yamaha FZ8 Grey

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2015, 12:09:57 PM »
Day 1

Ok I got it home, pulled her out the back of the van down the ramp with no brakes attached and the bloody back wheel fell off nearly squashing me underneath!

Luckily my neighbour was passing and helped me carry it into the garage.

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Let the work commence!

I got to stripping it down straight away, I had already ordered and received a haynes manual and a clymer manual for the process and started taking LOTS of pictures so I now where things go later.

By the end of day 1 it looked like this.

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on closer inspection there were a few problems emerging, 1.the side stand had been badly repaired and was welded at the wrong angle so the bike is leaning excessively. I will sort this out at a later date once the frame is stripped. 2.the centre stand has been hacked off and is in one of the boxes of bits!

I decided that once I had removed and stored some of the frame components, I would rebuild the original wheels that he supplied with the bike as my first big job, so I could work out the stance of the bike and sort that stand angle out!


Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2015, 12:12:16 PM »
Cheers tom400f,  i'm not to far along with it yet, and have already ran into a few problems, I guess all is to be expected with an old bike.

Hopefully I can keep a good momentum going!

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2015, 12:28:53 PM »
Day 2

Ok while stipping her down I had noticed a few  things, the front headlamp is off a suzuki, and while inspecting the exhaust it is blown on two downpipes and on the collector box, and there is no muffler! How did I miss that.

There's a chunk of my budget gone already :-[

Ash from this forum had kindly sent me a dropbox link with a parts list, which I have been going through in the evenings to see what I'm missing and the list is getting longer! I was originally going to restore to factory condition using all genuine parts, but I'm not sure my budget will stretch that far. It seems the old girl has had a harder life than I first thought.

I think I might modify it into a cafe racer/brat style bike, still using the best original parts with some OEM stuff now.

Ok wheel job today, the PO had just had the original rims chromed, but it was a terrible job and flaking off already, so Ive decided to get them blasted and possibly powder coated satin black?

They don't look bad in this but they are pretty crap in person.

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Here's the hubs once removed

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« Last Edit: July 21, 2015, 12:31:51 PM by beemsquar »

Offline tom400f

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2015, 12:38:07 PM »
What a shame about the chroming  :(

As for the exhaust system - if you were going for standard then when last sighted Dave at Saisei had a full repro set in stock: http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,8467.msg57828.html#msg57828

Budget permitting  ;)
1978 CB400F2 Yellow
1995 VFR750FS Red
1997 VFR750FV Lapis Blue
2013 Yamaha FZ8 Grey

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2015, 12:58:35 PM »
Day 3,4,5

I ordered the special tool and removed the bearing retainer caps, a pig of a job as they were loctited in, I did as others have mentioned and drilled out the stakes, which helped massively! well worth the £38 they cost to buy in my opinion. I ordered new retainer parts as I thought they might get pretty chewed up in the removal process, so I will replace these too.

The hubs have now had the bearings removed, I have cleaned all the internals and hub axles too. I have got an Allballs bearing and dust seal kit, o rings to install both back and front and Ferodo rear brake shoes to fit, but first I am sending the hubs off to be powder coated before I install the bearings.

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Bolts before  and after being wire wheeled

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In the meantime I have been cleaning all the wheel components ready for assembly as unfortunately the media blaster guy is away on holiday for a week so they can't be painted until then.

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2015, 01:14:29 PM »
Thats not a bad price Tom, I think David Silver is more than that for a complete system. Although I am not going completely original, I don't want to stray to far down the wrong path, the whole reason I got a 400 four was the way it looked and what I've heard about being fun to ride, I love the standard exhaust look too, something special.

I'm only 32, but have always appreciated classics over modern stuff, there's something about how temperamental they are that appeals to me and I think that's what gives them character. Sure its nice to just turn something on and go, but when you have to get your hands dirty and truly understand what and why something isn't doing what it's supposed to, it makes it more rewarding when it does.

That and the shear seat of your pants experience you get with old stuff!

I've never ridden a real motorbike before, only a DT50 from the age of 16-18, I passed my theory test last Friday and have my training and test for my A licence in September, so the plan is to get her built over the winter ready for shakedown test and running in in the spring.

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2015, 01:31:09 PM »
Day 6 to 17

Lots of stripping and cleaning parts the last 2 weeks, I've got a box of bits off to the media blaster, but he's doing it as a favour so nothing back as of yet.

Heres a few before blasting.

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I bought some Jizer and clutch cleaner to clean the engine, it has made some difference but it was very dirty. I think this bike must have been used off road as it was thick with mud! I'm thinking of powdercoating the crankcase, (not the block as I have put in another thread!) so it needs to be super super clean to prevent peeling later.

I contacted simple green who make an environmentally friendly cleaner/degreaser that the aviation and medical industry use that is tough enough to strip an engine but kind enough to clean food equipment

It's pricey though, I bought 3 946 ml bottles with 1 free for £37.99 inc delivery,   but for degreasing an engine you dilute it 1:10 with water, so I figure its not that bad. I got it from here, I'll let you all know how I get on with it.

http://www.simplegreen.co.uk/index.php/domestic-products

Time to start on removing the engine next while I wait for parts.

Offline tom400f

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2015, 01:47:14 PM »
Be warned - the repro headers are only single skinned. But yours are scrap so choice is that or get some sound originals and rechrome. Silencer from Dave as per.

You'll get on with Mick (Green1). He's about your age and thinks the same with classic bikes.

My son did his full license (24+) a few weeks ago after 3 months on a CBF125 and a few hours training on a Diversion (or something like that). He now rides a Suzuki Bandit though...
1978 CB400F2 Yellow
1995 VFR750FS Red
1997 VFR750FV Lapis Blue
2013 Yamaha FZ8 Grey

Offline Chris400F

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2015, 02:44:51 PM »
Hi beemsquar,
Good luck with the project - looks like you have made a good start already.
Here's another alternative for the exhaust. Original style, stainless so no rot and looks a reasonable price (cheaper than others).
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-CB400-4-4-1-Stainless-steel-pipes-and-collector-by-Motad-/161768793224
I have one of their non-stainless systems on my own 400, it's OK for the money.
If you find other bits you need you can always try a 'Desperately Seeking' post on here, someone may have what you need gathering dust.

Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2015, 02:50:27 PM »
Day 17 to 19

I have now removed the engine from the frame, which was not fun on my own!

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I'm not sure this is normal but , I struggled to remove the front engine bracket as there were a stack of washers on the crankcase bolts that made those bolts and the bracket bolts so close I couldn't get a spanner on them. should this have been like this?

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And while I was taking that picture I noticed this!!!!

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Not sure if this is fixable or not???

The last few days I have been slowly working on dismantling the engine, ready for a deep clean and overhaul, I sprayed all the bolts with a penetrating liquid over a few days. I  started to remove the rocker cover when snap! the first bolt I touched with hardly any pressure broke off in the head, there are screws and bolts on my rocker cover and I'm unsure if that is standard or other bodge on this poor old girl???  But the inevitable happened and a screw also snapped in the head with the lightest of turns.

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Hopefully they can be drilled out!!

Cheers for the link Chris, I will have a look at that good to keep your options open.

I looked at an original on 400fourbits, so might get an original used one yet, He's got a lot of parts I need so might doing a bulk order soon!


Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2015, 03:12:05 PM »
Day 20

So I removed the Rocker cover yesterday and found this nasty surprise, just plain lazy if you ask me!

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It removed OK, but will need replacing. when I get to put this back together should I replace the copper washers?

I removed the sprocket, cam chain slipper and tensioner and then proceeded with the removal of the head, which was surprisingly simple and got my first site of the pistons a little cruddy, but I was expecting worse, I guess it's been running too rich???

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I proceeded with the removal of the block yesterday  as I want to clean everything in one go so again it came off quite easily.

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As soon as the block was off piston number four gave up a piston ring to the crankcase! Definitely about time this thing had a tear down!

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Offline Saisei

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2015, 03:19:08 PM »
A nice variety of bolts you have there ;). With care and patience those sheared bolts should repair. Give them a good soak with penetrating oil plus heat the surrounding alloy before drilling. Try using left hand drills incrementing in size. If you are real lucky the stub might free off and spin out on the drill tip leaving you to just clean up the case thread with a tap.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEFT-HAND-STUB-DRILLS-65MM-7-4MM-/281739868990?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=&hash=item4199013b3e

As mentioned earlier, I do have one complete exhaust set left if interested. Yes, the downpipes are single skinned but this should not be an issue if the carbs are set up correctly.

http://www.saisei-europe.com/Shop/Products/c/exhaust/p/new-cb400f-silencer

Good luck with the project, I will watch this one with interest  :)


Offline beemsquar

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Re: CB400 Project
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2015, 03:34:37 PM »
Day 21

Cheers for the advice saisei, I will check out the link and have a think about the exhausts, they do look good!

Today I wanted to get the pistons off the conrods and measure and inspect everything before I go any further.

I removed the pistons again not as hard as I thought, but when I removed the gudgeon pins they felt slightly ridged and marked, is this normal wear or a thrashed motor?
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I measured all the pistons and bores (with my cheap digital calipers mind), they were all slightly out from each other but the worst measurements were these....

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I am going by a clymer and haynes manual, but from what they recommend, I think I could be in for a set of oversized pistons and a rebore?! Not what I wanted to hear.

There is also a slight gouge down bore number 2 that I couldn't get in a photo, so what are the options for me guys? By a used block and pistons or rebore and replace with oversized? What sort of cost am I looking at?

The other thing I had two pistons marked with the number 4 and 2 marked number 3, is that normal??? All four were original honda mind, thought maybe they were already oversized???
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So thats where I'm at at the moment, I was going to split the crank and order a gasket set, replacement stainless steel bolts and all the engine seals today, but I might wait and see what responses I get first!

 

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