Honda-SOHC
Other Stuff => Misc / Open => Topic started by: royhall on March 27, 2021, 09:20:25 AM
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Just a little heads up warning for anyone in the London area (or anywhere else) thinking of buying a classic bike. I have a Suzuki GS1000 in my garage that came from Rick Proops emporium in London known as RAPsuperbikes (you may have seen the full page adverts in the classic bike mags).
The engine on this bike had a top end rebuild by Mr Proops mechanic before it was sold. The bike has covered 800 miles since and is making a dreadful noise, smoking badly, and leaking oil from the head gasket. On stripping this is what I found.
Re-honed bores with new rings. On measuring the piston to bore clearance was between 7 and 8 thou, should be 2 thou.
The cylinder head nuts were loose, nipped at best.
The inlet valve guides were completely shot.
The wrong head gasket had been used.
The valves sealing surfaces were regressed past saving.
Two valve stem seals had been torn.
Two exhaust studs were in stripped threads with some goo holding them in.
The cylinder head gasket was blown and leaking oil and combustion products.
This bike was advertised and sold as having had a full top end rebuild. So buyer beware eh.
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Reads like misrepresentation by the seller to me did you purchase it recently might be worth contacting them for a response?
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On threat of legal action I was reimbursed a sum of money. But not until after a lot of auguments.
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I had my own 'dealings' with these guys years back, and would not go near the place ever.
They spend more money coating the engines in silicon spray than they do servicing them. Each 'classic' goes off for an engine valet and tart up, but clearly not a proper service. The bike I bought had an early fuel injection motor and ran richer than a busload of arabs. After 3 or 4 visits back no joy, including one after the fuel line split sprasying fuel all over some poor sod in an open top sportscar next to me at the lights.
In the end, I fixed it myself, replacing the return pressure restrictor, which was blocked with crud. This over pressured the gallery and dumped it into the inlet every time the injectors opened. Then, the valve guide oil seals started dumping oil and the smoke trails started.
I also discovered swing arm bearings so shot I could hit the swingarm into the pillion footrest mounts. The needle rollers collapsed when I took them out, as the cage had broken up. Packed with grease though.....fresh grease. Lots of it. I'll leat you make up your own minds about that one.....
It came with a 'Full Engine Warranty' .... HAH!
Which did not include anything. Valves..no...wear and tear mate, not covered. Pistons, rings, crank, bearings, gearbox. Wear and tear mate. Cams, camchain? Guess.
What was covered..... 'The Engine and Gearbox' .....
End result....one wiser me and a vow never to go near the place ever again.
I sold the bike on as spares/repair and advised the buyer to tear it down and go through everything and that while it would start and run, I was advertising it very much as a non runner.
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I don't know how he can call that shaved ape that works for him a mechanic. The rest of the bike wasn't much better.
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I'm just at the point of rebuilding the head on the GS1000. I was advised by the Suzuki people at Grumpy1260 to use Ape Racing valve guides as they are the best (and cheaper than original parts). After fitting them the intakes were spot on but the exhaust side the guide doesn't come right through the casting. All eight Ape guides are the same and they are correctly seated. This leaves a gap between the guide and the head casting that cant be correct. On original parts the intake is tapered but the exhaust has a radius end, and it's the taper that's the problem. The supplier is insisting it is correct but surely it cant be. Has anyone encountered this before?
The photos show a fairly large pick tool inserted into the gap, and you can clearly see the difference in the two original guides. Weird.
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I wouldn't go near him again, they like brush on black also.
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I've got it that the exhaust valve guides are important for heat transfer out of the valve as it has no cooling charge going past it like the inlet has.
Ordinarily they leave the ex guide snub nosed to prevent that itself from heating too much as it could with a taper. Even though it causes port restriction, cutting it back I feel is considered where outright port flow is considered above longevity, ie absolute race performance.
Bronze guides aim for that compromise anyway, with faster/efficient conductivity favoured over ultimately their lifing.
Perhaps they've good reason to supply as they have, but they should at least be able to explain why and the effect it has, rather than they're all like that sir.
Whether there's enough practical difference as to notice (if not racing it) I'm not sure.
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What they said was"sold 100s of those sets never had a problem" That makes it right then. Just waiting to hear back from Ape Racing themselves. I bet they say these are for gas flowed heads not standard, even though that's not stated anywhere. We shall see.
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Well I am surprised. Ape Racing have replied to my email to say that is correct. The dilemma now is do I leave it or change them for standard items. That gap may just fill with carbon I guess.
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I now have two sellers (who build engines) and the manufacturers themselves saying that gap is correct. Who am I to say otherwise so I am going to go with it and build the engine. But in my head that will never be correct.
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I can't see why you'd "want" a gap there, and they don't appear to be forthcoming with a convincing reason, so either can't be arsed to understand or the person that decides it should be that way doesn't elaborate :) always seems suspicious if it can't be explained ::)
But then I don't see that their heavy duty head studs can do what they claim either. ;D but that's another complete subject.
I doubt if it will make much difference, but if Suzuki designed, cast and specified it in original form, then I'd favour their expertise over ape, unless ape can forward a clear advantage and reasoning to contradict manufacturer.
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I'm convinced these guides go with gas flowing. They would remove an amount of material around that guide exposing the guide taper otherwise they are simply too short. It wasn't a very good answer this is it "They are correct. In high performance application's we do not run the long exhaust. WE install many of these in GS1000's. Regards Jay. Tech"