Honda-SOHC
General => New Member Introductions => Topic started by: pauliexjr on February 25, 2011, 12:21:22 PM
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OMG, am I glad I found this site, I was beginning to think I was the only SOHC owner left in the UK!
I'm Paul, I've been riding bikes for more years than I care to remember, I only passed my car test when I was 21 because the then girlfriend refused to ride pillion!
Latest project is a 1977 CB750 F2 with a genuine 10,700 miles on the clock, a true barn find I got off E-bay in November last year. Unfortunately my garage is huge and drafty and a b*gger to heat so I didn't do much over the Winter (we had 2 1/2ft of snow for most of December and a big part of January!) but now things are warming up I'm getting stuck in.
For anyone who's interested this is what I've got to work with:
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Frame.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Engine.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Bits.jpg)
My humourist son has already nicknamed it 'Project Rising Sun' and you can see I've got some work to do, but I'll post back as it moves along. :-)
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Hi Paul, welcome to the forum, there are lots of us F2 owners on here, and i have just finished restoring one and put an mot on the bike today
I have learned absolutely loads about the F2 during the last year or so and now know all its faults and all the fixes to the faults, where to get the bits ect,
They are great bikes and in my opinion the best of the SOHC 750's
Keep us posted on how yours is going and keep the photos coming
Pete
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That looks like fun, seriously it looks a bit like mine did before I breathed new life into it.
Den
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Hya pauliexjr, welcome! You are not alone, there are thousands of us inSOHC4RA (single overhead four restorers anonymous) here, you are "safe" we will not expect you, or advise you to be "in recovery" we will not tell your misses or immediate family just how much you are spending on this project.
We will not tell auntie that you used your christmas present ( that oh so lovely top) for an oil rag or polishing cloth. members here have even dropped off parts to other members under cover of darkness.
Here, we will not try to encourage you give up your new found "addiction" rather we will help you to embrace it by all means at members disposal... There is a wealth of information here, no problems are insurmountable... and some wonderfull folks to help you through the highs and lows of your restoration...
I too have this addiction, I am an addict, I recently "found" more parts that I had hidden in an upstairs wardrobe... I did not buy "project rising sun" of ebay.. I actually bought "The illegitamate beast of Bodmin moor" off ebay.... heres a pic.... Welcome!!!
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Thank you for your welcomes guys, much appreciated, I feel a bit like a new visitor to the AA, "My name is Paul, and I am addicted to lost causes!" I keep telling myself it looks worse than it is, but in my heart of hearts I know both my wallet and my leisure time are in for a serious pounding! But hey, I'll have some fun, and doubtless some skinned knuckles along the way.
This was my last lost cause about 5 years ago, I did say never again, but back to the AA I suppose....
Before:
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Bonniebeforeandafter.jpg)
and after
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Bonniebeforeandafter_1.jpg)
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hey Paul, lovely looking triumph..brings back memories.... I should get me misses to design a cb750 logo combined with a pic of St.Jude the patron saint of lost causes, and get some cloth badges made up!
When I stripped my cb750k2 down (the one in the picture) I believe that I had less usable parts than you may have... well at the least no more! Are you going to do it all yourself ( I have so far) or will it be off to the powder coaters etc...?
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I'm not sure yet. When my son (eventually) gets his jet ski out of my garage I might have a go at stripping and spraying the frame myself. Certainly the engine strip and rebuild will be down to me and as I'm looking at cafe racing it I've made enquiries with The Tank Shop in Dumfries about a custom alloy tank, but I'll need to save the pennies for that one!
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1st big common problem check the exhaust valve guides
2nd big common problem finding new piston rings
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Welcome Paul.
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1st big common problem check the exhaust valve guides
2nd big common problem finding new piston rings
Thanks for the welcome guys. I've seen the posts regarding exhaust valve guides, I've just had the head and barrels vapour blasted so I'm in a good place to check those.
The pistons and valves were coked to hell, but that could be because the bike started life in London and was used for lots of short-trip commuting.
I've got a new set of rings from David Silver so no probs on that.
But, how strong is the bottom end on the F2? I don't really want to split the crank, but I also don't want to build the whole thing back up, then be faced with clattering big ends or rumbling mains when I start it up! It's only done 10,700 miles, so how likely is it that the bottom end's been knocked out? I suppose this is really a post for the techies?
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Bottom ends are fairly bulletproof, anything can be damaged by an a numpty in its previous life tho'.
As its been in a dissasembled state for so long i personaly would strip and clean out the lower checking the primary chain wear first, cranks are not grindable and shells cost a lot so unless bad tend to get reused. Replace cam chain AND ALL THE RUBBER TENSIONER BITS----its over 30 years old and they get hard and break up.
Apart from the guides and being medicaly clean on rebuild (especially the oilways) thats about it.
I do have the genuineHonda dealer manual for the K8/F2 scanned to disc if you want a copy, postage plus a beer usually works
Cheers
Bryan
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Hi Paul, Bryan's reply is spot on as usual, he pretty much knows everything to know about F2,s
I took mine apart right down to every nut and bolt, i found that a previous owner had over tighened nearly every small 6 mm bolt bolt on the engine
some of the engine crank casing bolts were snapped off, and nearly all the head 6mm threads needed a heli coil insert as they were all done up well over the torque settings, as well as that silicon had been used on every gasket surface including the head
Anyway i got there in the end and now have a sweet engine, i replaced the rubber bits for the cam chain and tensoiner , new rings new vaves, new cam and tower plus all the rockers ,
Here is what i learnt about rebuilding an F2 engine, the main things that wear are the valve guides, and it is really worth getting them done, i got mine from DYnoman in the USA, the valve tips get indented so take a good look at them, again dynoman or cylex in usa sell these, also the valve spring seats crack so check them thouroughly and if your budget allows upgrade them again from the USA guys, when rebuilding the top end get yourself a parts manual and make sure you have every little rubber seal needed, there are four small rubber rings that go on the 4 inner studs at the bottom of the cylinder these get missed easily, them same four studs go up through the cylinder, and head and in the actual head they are not enclosed and so are open to the elements you will notice they are you rusty studs , when they arrrive at the top of the cylinder head they have to have a dome nut and brass washers on them or you will get an oil leak, also the four cam tower bolts some times are drilled right through and need to be sealed as they can get an oil leak that comes out right by your spark plugs, make sure you renew all the little o rings under the cam towers as well as the four rubber pucks, and if you can get one use a Original Honda head gasket
If your pistons and bores are good then new rings and a light hone and your good to go
As for the bottom end, i would take it apart and clean it right out of any sludge and nasty deposits, its not to hard to do and it gives you the chance to renew the drive shaft and crank seals, which after 30 or so years will be hard and worn , also the primary chains, and tensioner can be inspected or renewed
Last of all as Bryan says rebuild it in a clinical way no dust dirt whatsoever , these F2 bikes have a real tiny oil restrictor in the head and it will block up with the smallest piece of muck or dirt , and so trash your whole top end.
Pete
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Hi Paul and welcome to the forum.
Just to pick up on something Pete has alredy said, those 6mm bolts that get stripped threads so easily in the casting are really delicate to assemble in as much as it feels when you tighten them that they could not possibly be tight enough but they are. Use a good quality torque wrench of a very light (low) range to get an accurate feel on them, but you'll see what we mean when you do them as it feels no sooner have you started to tighten them then it's done, DON'T be tempted to add a bit more afterwards.
Looks like you've got most of the main bits to start with so can get along way with the basics.
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Hello, glad to have found this forum, it's a wealth of info! My name is Trent and reside in Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada. I'm currently rebuilding a 1973 CB750k3 engine to one day(year) to be put into a cafe style custom. In the past, restored a 1972 triumph T100R and a 1977 kz1000a which is still my summer runner. I've only had to do topend rebuilds on those bikes, this CB is a complete teardown and rebuild. Please have patience with my basic questions and input! Hope you'll accept a fellow CB enthusiast from across the pond! Cheers! - Trent
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cbnovascotia,
Heres an Odd one (me entirely) I was nearly a Canadian! My Mam and Dad were out there in the fifties (like many folk who went over) my old man was an aircraft fitter and was on contracts. They lived in Montreal, and Ottawa. My old lady got pregnant with me ( not having the slightest inkling I would later "go wrong")
Time passed, and when she was due to expell me from her internals, my fathers contract was due to expire.
Fearfull that he would not immediately get another contract, which would leave them having to pay for medical expenses (He was not a Canadian Citizen just yet) my Mam went into severe pregnant lady panic overdrive, and returned home to the UK to have me....which she duly did immediately, if she would have "dropped" me on the flight back, I guess I would have no nationality.... My father went on to gain USA citizenship and he has three valid and legal passports, Canadian, UK, and USA...
He made the papers in Canada over a court case for custody of his daughter ( my half sister who now lives in Mississippi) He was the first man in Canada ever to win Sole custody of a daughter/child.
The photos my mam have are amazing, the reds and oranges of the trees in autumn are just splendid.
She has photos of the Niagera falls frozen over in winter....Frozen... wow, I never knew they did this till she dug those photos out...a few years back. apparently they dont freeze every year?
She has a photo someone took of her hand frozen to her car door handle..when she forgot to put her gloves on....
One day I would certainly like to see where I was conceived ...and nearly born.
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Wow !! You really bring some good banter to this forum KaceyK2 ;D Keep it Up!
A warm welcome from me too pauliexjr !! Welcome to our friendly community!
Cheers
Ash
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Thanks, AshimotoK0, It sometimes seems a little quiet here, and I get frightened that no one is there.
I also get frightened about spiders (except David Thornes seven legged spider, which is worth a visit to his website just to enjoy www.27bslash6.com (http://www.27bslash6.com)) If you really need to laugh till you cry and hurt real bad, and have some time to kill, May I recomend a visit to his site and in particular (when you get there) :"Missing Missy" "Overdue account" "dear neighbour, you are not invited to my party" "please design a logo for me,with pie charts for free"
(A basic understanding of pie charts isn't on this occasion necessary,as Davids are extremely self explanatory)
Anyways, as I mentioned previously, I get a little frightened when I think No-one is there.
Once when I first switched on my computor, no one was anywhere on the internet at all.
I am not totally stupid and realised that something very serious must have happened on a world-wide basis for this to be true, and after many years of firmly believing the appocolypse to be just "round the corner" made the obvious assumption that this must have happened.
I immediately set about trying to contact Milla Jovovich, whom I knew to be the best person to have around in these circumstances.
Directory inquiries proved to be less than usefull on this occasion , even though they still charged me for the phone call. This reluctance on the part of directory inquiries just confirmed to me that they were helping to "cover -up" what had happened.
I am not frightened of Zombies per-se, because it's totally legal to kill them in any way that works.
Here are some of the ways that work; Beheading, setting on fire, eating their brains.
Here are some ways that don't work: shooting them in the foot, throwing plants at them, Holy water.
Every attempt to get my misses to dress up as Milla jovovich in a plausible attempt to frighten the expected zombies failed, in fact she got fed up and cross.
She then made me "restart" the computor, which sadly brought the "missing" 840 million internet people back.
Since then , I have tried to contact Milla Jovovich many times on her facebook page, in anticipation of an expected sudden apoccalyptic event in the near future.
Milla Jovovich, quite wrongly and without due consideration "unfriended" me.
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Okay Bud, you are either seriously deranged or have an expensive habit.....but funny as fek, repect!
You obviously have a fixation with Ms. Jovovich, so here is a photo I took of her the last time we were together:
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/Pauliexjr/Milla.jpg)
(OK, we can all fantasize can't we?)
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I don't plan on hosting a "Babe" thread here - I'll overlook that little slip though...
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Absolutely shocking!
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I don't plan on hosting a "Babe" thread here - I'll overlook that little slip though...
Apologies, my weak attempt at humour, won't happen again :(
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You are familiar with the Babe Thread (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=25300.0)?
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No I wasn't.....but I am now ::)
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So you'll understand why I don't want one on here!
;D
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Don't need a Babes Thread on here...let's just keep it bikes with the occasional pic of the wife/daughter/auntie on the bike but that's it. I'm not a prude by any means, but some of those girls leaning against 'CARS' are not worth looking at.
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You ought to live In Wales Yoshi,
Then you would know the true horror of "girls that arent worth looking at"
For some reason , (I believe it to be conected to pig farming) The Girls in Wales grow very fat very quickly.
Some are indeed just "Two KFC bargain buckets away from upsetting the earths rotational axis" soon we may have to export a passenger liner full of these porkers to Australia to counteract this imbalance.
I totally agree with you about the Babes thread, it's annoying.
If my Auntie was in the "babes" thread the moderators would close it down very quickly.
I have uploaded a picture of my Auntie,
It is My Welsh Auntie Margeret when she proposed marriage to a vending machine and the picture is therefore called "will you marry me?"
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So you'll understand why I don't want one on here!
;D
Totally Steve, As I said, it was a lame attempt at humour, unlike the one above which is just scary! ^^^^^
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Pauliexjr,
Margeret asked me if I would let you know that she is not scary, and that "scary thing she once did" is a very long time ago, and her doctor said it shouldn't happen again as long as no one tried to take her sandwich away.
The photo of when she proposed to the vending machine, was, to be fair taken at the end of a very long distressing and dissapointing week, that she had spent in the continual (and futile) search for a husband.
After spending a not inconsiderable sum (taken from her food allowance monies ) on a pair of "beyonce lookalike" jeans from TKMax, she tried her hardest to look attractive and even trendy by pulling her knickers up very tight , (despite the discomfort) because she hadn't the funds for a "man magnet thong" as she calls them, insisting that "men cant resist these, it says so on telly"
Anyways,
Her cheery and hopefull attitude was soon totally dashed in mac donalds, she went overdrawn on one credit card buying only three bigmacs and four large fries, and it was at this establishment that a major "hiccup" in her recovery happened.
When she asked the manager if he would marry her, he not only refused, but asked her to leave and advised her to "pull her pants up, theres children in here"
With that "cloud of gloom" hanging over her, she got into her ford fiesta ( the one with the broken O/S suspension mounting and damaged drivers seat)
and drove all the way to the Kentucky fried Chicken, where she believed she would be "in a safe place"
Apparently the purchase of only three "bargain buckets" does not entitle you to marry the manager, and she was asked to leave and advised to "pull up your pants theres children in here"
So, as you may imagine,
By the time she got to the vending machine she was feeling quite desperate,(and hungry again) hence the proposel of marriage..
she asked me to say that even though you thought she was "scary"
she Likes a man who speaks his mind and quoted "I like the cut of your jib sir" when reading your post.
( I think she got that from "the onedian line" or "hornblower" both of which she loves to watch because as she says "I bet they eat a lot of fish ")
she also asked if you was single?
I said I didn't know , but would ask, but didn't make any promises.
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KaceyK2, you're not the illegimate love child of Roald Dahl and Jordan by any chance are you?
Hey maybe you've got a book to write with that quantity of material!!
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kaceyk2,
Crazy tale about almost being Canadian, EH? I'll have to look up a photo of Niagara Falls frozen! I've been there once, it's a total tourist trap now. I was 20yrs and in a chevette full of friends. We couldn't afford to park, luckily there was slow moving traffic. So we took turns jumping out and running to the rail to take a peek. Parking fair would have dented the gin fund.
The turning fall leaves are incredible on the east coast, fall days may get a little chilled, but the best biking weather.
I see in your profile 'bike polisher'. Do you clean and detail bikes professionally? Or buff and polish aluminum forks,covers? I own and operate an auto detailing business. Motorcycles only account for a small %. I wetsand and buff the parts on my bikes, I enjoy that very much. People think it's crazy spending 1 to 2 hours on bench polishing an aluminum carburetor bowl! Thirty year old aluminum parts that have been in Nova Scotia are in rough shape. The roads are heavily salted in the winter plus the salty air in all seasons. Most old aluminum parts are in need of a 600/1000/1500/2500/3000 grit wetsand before a high speed compounding. People here have no clue how much work is involved. They can stick to their financed, midlife crisis, overchromed cruisers. Do you know them too? They have the Harley's, Vulcan's or any type of candy-looking cruiser and spend more time putting their clothing together, to look the part, then doing any maintenance on the actual bike. They'll spot you on an older bike and talk to you for an hour about their brother that had a moped in the '60's. You're just trying to get back on the road after a quick fill up and oil check. There are a ton of those fellas and their matching leather wives on the road over here. They gather at coffee shops and talk all night.Good resale though, on their low km bike!
Hopefully you can relate, otherwise, I might just be taken as a bitter biker that would like to see more appreciation for the older stuff!
-Trent
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They can stick to their financed, midlife crisis, overchromed cruisers. Do you know them too? They have the Harley's, Vulcan's or any type of candy-looking cruiser and spend more time putting their clothing together, to look the part, then doing any maintenance on the actual bike. They'll spot you on an older bike and talk to you for an hour about their brother that had a moped in the '60's. You're just trying to get back on the road after a quick fill up and oil check. There are a ton of those fellas and their matching leather wives on the road over here. They gather at coffee shops and talk all night.Good resale though, on their low km bike!
Hopefully you can relate, otherwise, I might just be taken as a bitter biker that would like to see more appreciation for the older stuff!
-Trent
Trent we have them, oh boy do we have them!
Particularly H*rley riders, most of whom seem to be accountants, solicitors, doctors etc. going through a 'mid-lifer' by buying the most expensive penis extension they can afford and riding it like a little old lady. What's worse is during the summer in Scotland they arrive in packs, along with the Gold-winger's in their arm chairs towing dinky little matching trailers!
Ever seen the film 'Wild Hogs'? :D :D :D
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cbnovascotia, NO, you just get given the term "bike polisher" untill you have done more posts..!!
When you have done a very lot of posts you get given the term "expert"
I believe ( probably unwisely) that when you have reached 1.12 million posts you get given the term;
"Supreme Lord of the single camshaft" and no one is allowed to argue with you or the moderators will intervene and demote them to the very lowly "I look in shop windows at shiny things that I'm not allowed to buy" avatar, which,( as you may imagine) would be embarrasing.
A quick word on Harleys,
In the seventies when I worked in a motorcycle shop, some folk did want to buy a Harley brand of motorcycle. BUT, Harley would not sell to the UK (they must have been embarressed about their product I think) Anyways, for these poor lost souls that did want a Harley brand of motorcycle more bad news was learned. If they did go and secretly import a Harley motorcycle, Harley would not send parts to the UK, thus making it a silly thing to do, to secretly import a Harley motorcycle.( Harley must also have been embarressed about the quality of their parts or something , not wanting to sell to the Uk an all)
So, for some seventies motorcyclists, this became a matter of principle..the "Not ever wanting to own a Harley then"
In my hayday,
Having any motorcycle was a good thing, made even more so if people thought it was (a)fast (b) looked good (c) shiny.
The reasons for having a motorcycle did vary , but on the whole they were as follows;
(a) to get to and home from the pub without walking or buses.
(b) to impress the girlies.
(c) to take the girlies to the pub or home from the pub without the need for walking or buses.
(d) to go out at the weekends for big rides with the girlies.
(e) to go out at weekends for big rides with the said girlie riding pillion.
(d) and (e) are not the same thing.
There appeared ( at the time) to be only one problem, and that was this....
money.
Money was in short supply, so a constant "juggle" had to take place, between Fuel, and beer, you needed fuel to get to and back from the beer, it was uncool to run out of fuel and have to push you motorcycle with the girlie walking next to you...this is not what girlies wanted to be seen doing.
BUT, if you put in to Much fuel, then you might not be able to buy beer, and the girlie might have to buy her own beer.
this is something that the girlie did not like doing too much and made them complain sometimes.
Or, you might have to make your beer last for a very long time, ( which some of us learnt to be very good at) But you did not want the girlie to make her beer last for a very long time, in fact you wanted to get as much down her as possible, in the given time , in the hope of accomplishing (d) above.
Nobody, Nobody at all, had a "Harley credit card"
Honda goldwings were not called Honda goldwings, they were called "armchairs"
Pulling a trailer with a motorcycle, was deemed as odd and would not get you a girlie.