Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB500/550 => Topic started by: SteveW on August 19, 2020, 03:47:33 PM
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Got a small amount of sideways movement in my swing arm.
Do I just need new bushes or is there anything else I need as well?
And is it just drift old bushes out and fit new ones?
Thanks.
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Got a small amount of sideways movement in my swing arm.
Do I just need new bushes or is there anything else I need as well?
And is it just drift old bushes out and fit new ones?
Thanks.
In my experience the collar wears too even though you would expect the bushes to wear in preference. Collars are very expensive. Some bushes are plastic some are steel depending on model. Trigger/Julie sells repro bronze ones I think.
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If its just sideways play and not twisty play, then surely the right size thin washer, if you could find it, could fix it?
I guess to keep chain line problems at bay, a thinner one either side of the swinging arm would be even better.
Just a thought, a real engineer will be along soon to tell me I'm being stupid.
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I think your bike is a 550K0 yea? If it is the original setup will have the phenolic plastic bushes at the end ... a carry over from the CB450 then 750 design. These may be damaged/worn if it is just sideways play. The aftermarket bronze ones does away with these as they are a top hat shape.
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Originally there is a bush, felt ring,plastic thrust and steel cup washer all held in by tightening the through bolt.
If everything is there try tightening the nut on through bolt which needs to be very tight.
If the bushes are worn you WILL need a new collar (about $100) if you fit the top hat brass you wont need the felt or plastic thrust but you do need the steel cup washer
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Mine is a 74 550. So if I have the plastic bushes does that mean I may not have to change the collar?
I’ll try tightening everything up tomorrow first to see if that helps.
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No mate, the plastic bushes wear the collar just as much as the metal ones and are even more of a swine to get out, big problem is people dont grease the pin enough, i recon maximum 1500 miles or if its raining when you get home every time
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No mate, the plastic bushes wear the collar just as much as the metal ones and are even more of a swine to get out, big problem is people dont grease the pin enough, i recon maximum 1500 miles or if its raining when you get home every time
Thanks Bryan, I’ll check tomorrow and see if I can get away with tightening for now.
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I’ve just undone the through bolt.
All there was a steel washer under the head of the bolt and a steel nut and washer the other end.
I’m guessing I may have parts missing?
The bolt is in good condition at least, I have not tried to get the bushes out.
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From memory there was no washer, have a look at the parts diagram at cmsnl 500 and 550 are same.
The nut is, or should be, a locking nut
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The nut is a lock nut.
How tight can I do the through bolt up?
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Very, the frame will squeeze in and trap the washers and collar before the bolt breaks, as long as all the correct parts are in there
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A 74 550 can be either a 550K0 or a 550F1 and they both have different swinging arms with different bushing systems.
Has the petrol tank got a flap covering the cap or is the cap an exposed chrome one?
NO 550F1 in 1974 Ken ;)
A 1974 550 should have the same set up as a CB500 four, same frame and swing arm.
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Exposed fuel cap
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On my vin plate it’s says built Nov 73
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It will be the same as my 550K1 (USA model)
https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb550-k1-four-1975-usa_model466/partslist/F++07.html#.X0NvScgzaUl
originally there is no washer under bolt head, only washer under nut (self-locking)
Stockt setup is: Bush-Felt ring-Thrust bush-Dust seal cup (steel)
And I can confirm what was said here, I had worn bushes and collar too (yes, expensive).
You will know once you dissassemble it, apart of dirty chain work it is quick to do
I recommend bronze bushings from Julie, before installng them make sure your swing arm is clean w/o debris where bushes will go. In my case they went in pretty tight, I used threaded rod to press them in (I would put them into freezer for hours before assembly next time)
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Thanks for the info Erny :)
Following Bryans advice I have just tried tightening the swing arm right up.
60ft lbs - still have play
80ft lbs - play has gone completely.
My question now is, was my play in the swing arm just down to it not being tight enough or is it still worn and I'm just masking the fault by over tightening it?
Have left it at 80ft lbs for the moment, haven't taken the bike out yet. Just want to gauge opinion first.
Thanks.
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Thanks for the info Erny :)
Following Bryans advice I have just tried tightening the swing arm right up.
60ft lbs - still have play
80ft lbs - play has gone completely.
My question now is, was my play in the swing arm just down to it not being tight enough or is it still worn and I'm just masking the fault by over tightening it?
Have left it at 80ft lbs for the moment, haven't taken the bike out yet. Just want to gauge opinion first.
Thanks.
At 80 ft/lb does the swing arm still move up and down? If yes, that's good, if no, then it's too tight and needs backing off. It needs to swing when you move it up and down manually, it should have a bit of resistance to the swing and not just drop down and hit the floor with no resistance.
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Thanks Julie,
I've just disconnected the shocks and the swing arm moves up and down freely, I cant feel it binding or anything.
It drops to the ground under its own weight.
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Thanks Julie,
I've just disconnected the shocks and the swing arm moves up and down freely, I cant feel it binding or anything.
It drops to the ground under its own weight.
Haha, this is one of those things that is so difficult to describe. If it drops to the floor fast under its own weight, it's too loose, if it drops to the floor very slowly under its own weight or you have to push it by hand to get it to the floor, that's about right. The most important thing is that the swing arm can swing.
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Thanks Julie, that's saved me a few ££.
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If you grab the wheel end and pull/push sideways can you feel any play at the bearing/frame junction.
If not pump it full of clean grease and see how it "falls" then
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If you grab the wheel end and pull/push sideways can you feel any play at the bearing/frame junction.
If not pump it full of clean grease and see how it "falls" then
No play at all.
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In that case lotsa grease and your good to go
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Last night I fitted the swinging arm to my Z1 for the first time, and found that following this thread had been a great help, when it came to how tight the spindle nut needed to be - well tight made the swinging arm stiff, I backed off the nut until it was too loose, and went for something in between.
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I see you have solved this so very good.
For others looking at this problem, be sure that the movement is coming from the joint with the frame and check movement with the wheel off.
When I took mine for it's first MOT in 1995, after I had fitted new bushes, the tester found movement when hauling the back wheel side to side but it turned out that the swing arm itself was flexing, there was no movement at the joint. 1970s frame design was the conclusion.
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I see you have solved this so very good.
For others looking at this problem, be sure that the movement is coming from the joint with the frame and check movement with the wheel off.
When I took mine for it's first MOT in 1995, after I had fitted new bushes, the tester found movement when hauling the back wheel side to side but it turned out that the swing arm itself was flexing, there was no movement at the joint. 1970s frame design was the conclusion.
I don't think the tester should be applying that much force. Not necessary to detect play! 😯