Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => Project Board => Topic started by: petermigreen on September 01, 2016, 08:08:10 PM
-
Back in May, fresh on a high after completing my Yamaha restoration, I gave in to a whim and bought an imported CB400F on ebay and then drove 240 miles round trip to pick it up. With thanks to some of you on here I established it would go in my tiny van.
[attach=1]
I was hoping it would be a bit of a tidy up to get it through an MOT so that I could start the registration process but on inspection of the bike in the cold light of day I soon realised that I had a bit of work to do to get to that stage. With this in mind I decided that I didn't want to throw money at a full on restoration (i.e. chrome/paint work) so have sorted the essentials at this stage and will probably do the paint and chrome in time.
-
As soon as I got the bike in the workshop before I started the strip down, I thought it prudent to see if it would run as it was sold as a non-runner although it had not been attempted to start it since arrival in the country. To my joy and relief it started fairly easily (with some carb cleaner squirted in the carbs) and eventually ticked over ok.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoWYXYRW070
It didn't sound great and I've since discovered a big hole in the silencer and the carbs were flooding/leaking so understandable.
I have to say that the bike was sold as a low original mileage (11k) bike and being a natural sceptic I was nervous of the claims and prepared myself for the work however, various signs have been found during the strip down have convinced me of it's authenticity.
-
So the strip down commenced and right away I started to find signs of bodging/butchering that had me worried.
The first was that the start button was missing and what I thought was a bicycle bell had been substituted on the opposite side as a starter. Just 'why'?
[attach=1]
I was pleased to rip that out, but now I knew I definitely needed a new right hand switchgear.
Next big shock was the airbox which I can only guess was attacked in a tantrum as it was completely stoved in. Very strange.
My overall assessment of things that needed sorting before an MOT was viable was:
New tyres (possibly originals still on)
Fork stanchions re-chromed
New Shocks
Rewiring of loom to eliminate US spec front lighting
Repaired or new Silencer
In addition, whilst stripped, I decided to bring the following up to scratch to eliminate more work later down the line:
Repair rusted tank/pet cock
Refurb carburettors
Sort airbox and missing associated parts
Remove engine, strip top end, inspect, address requirements, paint
Replace heavily rusted wheels/Restore hubs
Powder coat frame/parts
-
I decided that to expedite the rebuild and hopefully get some miles on the bike before the end of this season to press on and get it stripped in quick time and get the out sourced parts off to the suppliers in order to get them back whilst I completed the bits I could do at home.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
No hanging about.
-
First big job I set about was strip and ultrasonic clean the carbs. Inevitably I found a broken float post in no. 3 carb.
[attach=1]
Bummer. Still, I managed to source a second hand carb body and rebuilt carb bank. Bit of a step up for me from my experience with a 2 stroke twin. Much labelling and photographs taken.
[attach=2]
-
As the clocks were in a bit of state
[attach=1]
-
I know my limits and this was a job for someone with special skills, so I was very pleased to discover this forum has an extremely valuable member whom I contacted and was very impressed with his work.
[attach=1]
Massive thank you to Kent400, and for the lifting handle also :D
Very nice work and a true gentleman who gave me the impression that he just really enjoyed restoring clocks and his immaculate original condition 400.
-
I fear I cannot hope to match Peter's craftsmanship with the rest of the restoration but I had a benchmark to live up to.
With all the parts back from powder coating and a couple of repro parts from various suppliers, I started bolting things back together.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
Clocks look nice!
[attach=3]
-
I made some pretty quick progress at this stage
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
[attach=3]
-
The original wheels were pretty badly rusted so I'd decided to buy some stainless rims and spokes and I polished up the hubs as best I could.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
I enjoyed building the wheels and tensioning and truing them after having done many bicycle wheels. Same principle and technique but far sturdier.
-
I'd been putting it off but had to strip the engine down if I was to repaint it. I initially stripped the top end only on the proviso that I'd strip bottom end only if necessary.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
There was a sign that it had been run with a loose cam chain during it's life but otherwise all signs were good that the claimed mileage was genuine with very little wear and no nasties in the sump or oil. Result, so I set about cleaning the parts and repainting as polishing was out of the question.
-
Quite laborious but ultimately satisfying to get finished and slide it back in the hole.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
[attach=3]
-
So that's it, up to date. I now await cables and the tank to finally cure and am hoping to start and run very soon. Then I'll book an MOT and start the registration process. Looking forward to taking it for a cruise before Autumn. Wish me luck!!
Thanks for the help I've received with the few questions I've asked and had replies.
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
-
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
[attach=3]
-
Well done Peter, its looking really great. I hope you get it on the road soon. I must say you have a very tidy workshop and I bet you wish you had completed all that work in the same short time it took you to post that lot on the forum tonight ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Well done on getting to the stage you have done given the time constraints.
I am in a similar place with my own 'project 400' and hope to finish in the next couple of weeks.
The main issues I've had are pattern parts that don't fit, have been incorrectly described or even genuine parts that have been superseded by poorer quality 'genuine' parts.
Having said that if it wasn't for the great people on this fantastic forum offering guidance and knowledge I wouldn't be as far as I am now with the build!
I hope you finish yours soon and the sun shines on the first ride, good luck and keep going, it will be worth it :)
Dave
-
Really good job done there Peter, far easier restoration than the model A Ford you have no doubt. I seem to remember your speedo was quite rusty inside due to the body damage having distorted the rubber seal. Water ingress probably made worse by use of a power washer with some enthusiasm at some stage.
Interestingly another speedo turned up last week that's rusty inside caused by a very poor substitute for the trip grommet which allowed the water ingress. Speaking to the owner he's owned it from new and it's now covered 100390. That's right one hundred, thirty nine thousand miles. It had a rebore at 70k miles but the bottom end hasn't been touched. Three cam chain replacements. It seems however he's been changed the oil and filter every 1000 miles. He's not a member on here, too old for these computers apparently at 58!
The speedo mechanism was still serviceable once all the rust from the corroded inner body was removed.
-
Thanks for sharing. I enjoyed reading it and studying the pics, great job. It's an unusual beastie this side of the pond with its larger yankee back light. When is it on the road or is it already?
+1 on the HT caps, best get a set of NGK ones, 1,4 are different from 2,3.
-
Thank you for all the kind positive comments. Don't worry, new plug caps are on order.
Sheesh, you don't miss much do you!!
By the way, I did replace the horrendous American spec handlebars, they just look so wrong in my opinion.
Mike, bike not on road yet but imminent.
-
Great looking bike, I had one 30years ago , the current owner won't sell it back to me, grr!, I see they featured one on last night classic TT program, that must say something about them, anyway nice work!.
-
I received a big box of parts this week so have made some progress but I still feel a long way off just yet :'(
Managed to get all the cables and pipes hooked up to the carbs and straight away noticed petrol overflowing out of 2 and 3 so out with the carbs again and replaced the float valves and re-set float heights. Felt prudent to test on the bench before refitting.
[attach=1]
So back on with the bowls and back in the bike, after spending what seemed like an hour trying to 'encourage' the float bowl gaskets back into their recess!! That's like some kinda fricking Chinese puzzle!! Happily though carbs are no longer overflowing.
I'm now in the situation where the engine starts fine and runs but I'm way off on the carb adjustments and I'm even struggling to set a decent idle as the revs seem to rise and fall randomly. Very rich judging by the plugs and smoke coming out of the silencer also.
I have bought some vacuum gauges but am a long way off getting to that fine tuning stage.
Also, the tacho seems to glide up and down rather than follow the true engine revs if that makes sense. Not sure this is correct but it's a brand new cable and it's free so a bit confused about this.
Any carb tuning experts out there??
In addition to the carb woes, I've got no clutch either, that is to say that I don't think the mechanism is making contact with the clutch as there is no resistance at the lever whatsoever.
Also received notice that the VJMC honda dating officer has received my application so the registration process is in motion.
-
There's a coarse clurch adjustment under the triangular plate on the clutch cover.. It sounds like that needs tweaking.
-
Update -
Been a bit of an eventful week and I had to walk away for a few days to gather my thoughts.
I've had the carb bank back off the bike and whilst on the bench the fast idle cam fell off its spindle! Happens to be lucky as it made me realise why my choke mechanism wasn't behaving as it should.
As I was at the VJMC day at Ace Cafe on Sunday I took the opportunity to get a good look at the mechanism on a tidy 400/4 on the VJMC club stand and got a few photos for reference.
So choke mechanism repaired, carbs re-stripped and rebuilt with all new jets, O rings etc. and all datums reset. Got them back on the bike last night and balanced tonight and bike now singing like a bird. Beautiful.
With the engine tuned I decided to drain the oil and remove clutch cover so I could solve the lack of clutch issue. Turns out the course adjustment screw was corroded into the mechanism which is why I couldn't adjust it in the usual way. That's now cleaned and fettled and I now have the clutch back in action.
Very satisfying as all the major problems are now overcome I have an MOT booked for Saturday week and my dating letter is now with me. So after MOT I'll be able to send off to the DVLA for my historic bike age related registration.
You never know I may just get a ride or two in before the leaves fall. 8)
-
Clutch sorted so couldn't resist a quick test run to make sure it all checks out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXdxi6wLJEY
Very pleased.
(Yes I did miss 2nd gear :-[ cos I was just so excited ;D)
-
How exciting and I see you have one of those invisible number plates ;D ;D ;D
-
How exciting and I see you have one of those invisible number plates ;D ;D ;D
"Must have fallen off Officer!" or 'It's in the post, honest" ;D 8)
-
;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I'm after one of those pixellated ones you see on the telly
-
I'm after one of those pixellated ones you see on the telly
Mike, buy yourself a black marker pen and a grey marker pen, you could make your own.
-
Absolutely great Peter and so was the following you tube clip. Now that model A was really a challenge a real credit to you.
-
Thank you Peter, no skill, just time and money.... and lots of it.
-
MOT passed with no issues, so really pleased about that.
Registration document in the post to DVLA, looking at a tense wait now before finding out if the application is successful and if so what the new registration number will be!! Should be able to put on a black/silver plate too due to age.
Will post again when I know.
-
I'm sure that 1973 was the cut off point for black and silver number plate, although I stand to be corrected!
-
Just found this - https://insidedvla.blog.gov.uk/2015/11/17/whats-the-story-with-black-and-silver-number-plates/
My 400 was manufactured September 1974 so should be all good.
-
Although, rather confusingly, exemption from paying vehicle tax is a different cut off date.
"Historic vehicles
Vehicles made before 1 January 1976 are exempt"
No wonder there's so much debate!!
-
The Historic Vehicle class is a rolling system - vehicles can be classed thus when they reach 40 years old.
I think the number plate thing works the same way - what you read about cut off date was correct at the time it was written.
I'm sure there is a previous thread that looked at this but right now I'm afraid I haven't got time to look for it.
The Historic Vehicle class has certainly been covered in other thread(s).
-
If you read all of the dvla article in that link inc the q&a section you will see that the number plate date is fixed and NOT a rolling date. The cut off is vehicles manufactured BEFORE Jan 1st 1975, and that is that!
-
If you read all of the dvla article in that link inc the q&a section you will see that the number plate date is fixed and NOT a rolling date. The cut off is vehicles manufactured BEFORE Jan 1st 1975, and that is that!
Wot he said!
-
I stand corrected. I must have misread the article. I even confirmed this with the DVLA, who said:
"I can confirm that the eligibility of a vehicle to display the black and silver registration plates is fixed. The vehicle must have been manufactured prior to the 01/01/1975.
There is no indication at present that this date will be changed."
So it's just the Historic Vehicle class (and associated free road tax) that is on the 40 year rolling basis.
-
Fascists! waited 2 weeks and received a letter saying I've got to arrange an examination.
No riding for me before Christmas then. >:(
-
Where will you have to go for that Peter?
-
Short answer, don't know.
Number given to call is in Kent. Although the letter states the inspection will be arranged at home address where possible.
Won't know for sure till I can get through during office hours on Monday. Then another 5 day wait for confirmation of place/date/time for the examination.
Just really frustrated that it takes 2 weeks to get this notification (hurry up and wait) when I'm aware that others have received their actual registration in 7 days.
-
That's dvla for you. It took them 6 weeks to correct a single number on my V5 before I could get it MOT'd. Six weeks of perfect riding weather too.
Note the resemblance... Resistance is futile and all that.
-
They really are a law unto
themselves
But I'm hoping they may have come up trumps for me this time
The cl77 had no v5 as it was lost....but was apparently uk registered previously
I filled out a v62 With just the vin on it...expecting a negative reply...
Instead I got an email asking for pictures and a rubbing of the stamp...as you would a dating letter
I did ring the girl..to clear up exactly what they wanted. (I've kept her number) and she was very helpful pretty much saying they had the info ..
I then had an email saying they won't release the details for a fortnight due to security reasons ...so hopefully they have all the details and number plate .....
Time will tell it's a fortnight this Tuesday. ..
-
Knowing my luck it willProbably come back with a frigging Q plate
-
Resistance is futile and all that.
That's the Vogons from THHGTTG - they were the galaxy's bureaucrats.
Maybe there's a sub-basement somewhere in the DVLA that is rented to the Galactic Hyperspace Planning Council.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
I was referring to the Borg...a cube structure manned by mindless automatons, just like the DVLA.
-
Holy crap, you work fast! :o
-
Holy crap, you work fast! :o
Nah, not really I just had a good base bike to start with. Yours on the other hand, looks a real challenge!
You should see the car I restored, took 8 years and I got made redundant 3 times whilst doing it.
-
;D
I'm 7 years and one redundancy into my car resto. Only pulled the motor for a quick swap... :-[
-
Yeh, mine started as a leaking roof.......
-
Did you fix the leak, or get to the end and then realise you'd done everything else but. :P
Still haven't plumbed the engine in on mine. ::)
-
Yeh sure, I fixed it good.
[attach=1]
-
Very cool and right up my street. 8)
-
That car has to be a show winner. Top work.
-
Thanks for your kind words.
Shameless bit of self promotion but here is a link to the restoration for anybody who may be interested.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCtFoB8SB1w
Peter.
-
That's a cool vid. Astonishing amount of work in there. Even though I come from the cut it up and race it camp, it's good to see someone restoring one. 😎
-
Thank you. Very old Ladies of nearly ninety deserve the utmost respect I think.
-
Awesome.
What skilled people we have on here.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Bike finally inspected by an independent agency today. So still waiting.
Expect to hear from DVLA hopefully sometime before I die. With luck.
-
;D ;D ;D Finally!!!
Received my prepaid envelope back in the post today with my driving licence, MOT, Insurance document etc. etc.
But most importantly notification of my age related registration and as hoped on an 'N' for 1974.
Looks a bit chilly tomorrow but I won't be able to resist a blast round the lanes as soon as I get my new plate made up! 8) 8) 8)
-
Great news, I envy that moment you'll be getting tomorrow , there's no better feeling than the first ride after all the hard work, and on one of the greatest bikes ever produced IMO, brilliant, enjoy!
-
Bitter sweet today, rode about 50 miles in brisk conditions. Chilled to the bone now.
Initially thought the bike wasn't as powerful as I was expecting and then discovered only running on 3 cylinders. No.1 was not firing and that turned out to be just a duff plug luckily. With a new plug installed back on 4 and power increase noticeable instantly.
However, with the increase in power the clutch started to slip! Quick adjustment and happily that seemed to solve the problems.
It just goes to show that finishing a restoration is only half the battle and getting miles on it to highlight any teething troubles is essential. Which is why I have been itching to get out and about and the month plus long wait for the registration has been very frustrating.
Anyway, a happy ending...
[attach=1]
And I'll be changing the number plate for a black and silver one as soon as it arrives.
-
Glad it's all worked out. When you get some time, check over everything with a socket set, just to make sure nothing's going to fall off.
-
Got to leave a happy ending. Can't wait for that day. It's a long way off though.
-
Now that's more like it!!
[attach=1]
-
Nice looking number plate is that.