Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB500/550 => Topic started by: MCTID on May 14, 2022, 10:59:29 AM
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Just cleaning up the Electrickery bits on my CB500 Four and found these little 'gremlins' !
I wouldn't mind but I bought the bike off an Electrician !
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Cant see anything wrong with the points and at least its a fuse not a nail BUT 500 fours always had singlr fuse not 3 fuse fusebox
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Not the split/frayed wire Bryan?
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;D ;D
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Not on my dumfone Steve, pics aint great on there and the laptop has decided to crap out on me!
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It's a 500K2 Bryan so it was virtually a 550 by the time Honda had finished altering it.
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Maybe, but K2 was never imported to UK Ken, or at least not by Honda UK
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No but that's what he's got.
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The Frame is 72 K1 20865XX and Engine is 73 K2 21781XX....Import and 76 R Reg....not sure where it's from originally but possibly France as it has French on the VIN Plate.
Sorry about the poor photos....the Yellow wire to the points was frayed to bug&%$y and I was a bit nonplussed with the 13 Amp Fuse.....and there was a spare 13 Amp fuse in the Fuse box cover as well. Not what I expected from an Electrician.....a 'get you home' maybe, but replace it with a proper Fuse ASAP.
Still scratching my head about the racket it's making...so I suppose the Electrickery gremlins are the 'least of my worries' !
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A 13A BS1361 fuse is a proper fuse!
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The Frame is 72 K1 20865XX and Engine is 73 K2 21781XX....Import and 76 R Reg....not sure where it's from originally but possibly France as it has French on the VIN Plate.[...]
Both numbers indicate yours is a CB500K2 (ED, F, G) aka CB500K2 GENERAL EXPORT which was quite different than the CB500K2-A, traded in the US three years earlier (1973). Your (and my) model share a lot with the CB550K2, which was US only (1976).
The appropiate part list is here: https://www.honda4fun.com/dwnload/Part-List/CB500/CB500-K2-76-Parts-List.pdf. (the engine- and framenumbers are listed on p.4) and CMSNL has this model hidden somewhat, but you can find it here: https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb500k2-general-export_model50441/partslist/
Yours has the central grease nipple fitted under the swing arm and three fuses. To determine whether it is the -F (France) model, check the carbs number. The -F model had the 627B carbs, the -ED and -G had the 649A carbs. The latter had the AIR DUCT over the airfilter, the -F didn't.
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The Frame is 72 K1 20865XX and Engine is 73 K2 21781XX....Import and 76 R Reg....not sure where it's from originally but possibly France as it has French on the VIN Plate.[...]
Both numbers indicate yours is a CB500K2 (ED, F, G) aka CB500K2 GENERAL EXPORT which was quite different than the CB500K2-A, traded in the US three years earlier (1973). Your (and my) model share a lot with the CB550K2, which was US only (1976).
The appropiate part list is here: https://www.honda4fun.com/dwnload/Part-List/CB500/CB500-K2-76-Parts-List.pdf (https://www.honda4fun.com/dwnload/Part-List/CB500/CB500-K2-76-Parts-List.pdf). (the engine- and framenumbers are listed on p.4) and CMSNL has this model hidden somewhat, but you can find it here: https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb500k2-general-export_model50441/partslist/ (https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb500k2-general-export_model50441/partslist/)
Yours has the central grease nipple fitted under the swing arm and three fuses. To determine whether it is the -F (France) model, check the carbs number. The -F model had the 627B carbs, the -ED and -G had the 649A carbs. The latter had the AIR DUCT over the airfilter, the -F didn't.
Wow, that's impressive knowledge.
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I've been thinking about the weird noise the engine makes Roy, is it top end related as I'm thinking it may be rocker shaft or rocker related. The K2 would have the longer type fitted but I think without the cotter pin arrangement of the 550s, so they could be spinning or have surface damage that causes the rocker arms to move slightly.
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[...] The K2 would have the longer type fitted but I think without the cotter pin arrangement of the 550s, so they could be spinning or have surface damage that causes the rocker arms to move slightly.
According to his engine number, his has the longer 4 rocker shafts and not the 8 shorter. AFAIK and according to the parts list p.13 that mod included he cotter pin arrangement.
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There are definately 3 itterations
1 8 short shafts
2 4 long shafts
3 4 long shafts with cotters
I know this as i have SEEN them all, you cant trust engine numbers and Honda parts books have mistakes plus the interchange of parts over the yeard
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May be, but it matters more where you have seen them. As far as errors in Honda documents, I've detected a few in the Shop Manual Honda CB500-550, but not in the parts list that covers this model. But let's not make it more complicated than necessary. On the Cylinder Head Cover you will find 4 extra nuts (and washers) which fasten the cotter pins. The forsaid parts list is perfectly clear on this, in p.9,10 and 13. If they are not present, no cotter pins. Concerning the CB500, you will only find them on the CB500K2 (ED, F, G) and the CB500K3-ED
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Here are my Rockers.....they appear to be in good condition - as does the Camshaft. I can't see any cotters ? Are they hidden under the RUBBER,SEALING, part number: 91318300013
I'll let you fellas fight over it ! LOL.
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The 500 tended to have the long shafts after a certain engine number, however unlike the 550 they were not pinned into place via cotter pins. I'd say the pins would be under the pontefract rubbers Roy, if you'd take a pic of the other side you'd know for sure as they are easy to spot from the top.
You can see the 500 long shafts on CMS, they don't have the cut out section the 550 ones have.
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Yep, under the cluster of four pontefract cakes in the centre. As Oddjob says, easily seen on the other side.
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It's not mine Ken, it belongs to Alan (MCTID) but I have heard it running. Short story is, he bought it running and it sounded sweet. It then had a trailer ride home and taking it off the trailer it fell over (fairly gently). When it was started after that it has a knocking noise that's quite hard to pin down. It knocks worse at tickover but the knock speed increases with revs a bit like a failing big end would. it's also running quite badly that wont be helping with backlash noise that's why he has been going through the electrics. My first thoughts were that something has become dislodged either with vibration on the trailer or the fall, but I cant help really as I know virtually nothing about the 500/550. So over to you guys.
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Rocker faces all look quite good.
A remote possibility, friend of mine had a Buell that was knocking just as you lifted revs off tickover and got louder up to about 2000tpm, were both swayed by reports of lubrication (from other owners) and possibly a big end play. It sounded just like a big end but we couldn't pinpoint it there by using listening rod/stethoscope etc.
Turned out to be the horn casing mounted up on the top yoke and touching the fork stanchion as it vibrated ;D it sounded sooo engine though, but we couldn't initially attribute it to anything in there.
Maybe something in this fashion as nothing would usually change inside the engine if it fell over.
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Seen as in actualy taken apart by me!
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Pipes touching the frame ?
It's relatively easy to bend a rear footrest hanger when a bike falls such that the pipes start touching something to make a clunking resonance.
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Those pics look promising good. BTW, the easiest way to check whether the cotter pins are there or not, is to simply lift the breather cover. It's there you'll find the extra 4 nuts... or not. Just a quick look at p.9-10 in the parts list would have told you that.
The cause of the sound may well have its origin in the drop of the bike. Can you inform us some more on which side the bike fell, etc, so the professionals here can make a guess.
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Will have to leave that up to Alan if he wants to say what went on as I wasn't there when it happened.
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Thanks for all the concern over this. It's great that people can be bothered to help another Forum member.....not like the Triumph Forum I'm also on where some peeps seem to delight in sniping...and the misfortune of others.
Anyway....when I was taking the bike off the Trailer on my own.......it had been a long day and I'd been driving for around 8 hours all told, I neglected to take one of the Ratchet Straps on the LHS off before I loosened the 'next to last' strap....the bike was still under tension and fell over. SH!!!!!!!T ! I could have cried. Luckily the LHS Rear Shock fell onto the Rubber Trailer Mudguard and unbelievably it absorbed the fall, and there was no damage of any note !
I struggled for about 10 minutes, then got my Neighbour to help me unload the bike and I left it until the next day before I started it.........that's when it was making a racket. It didn't do so when I collected it - although I'd bid on E Bay and paid by Bank Transfer before collecting it...so I couldn't really complain to the Seller as it ran reasonably well and quietly at his house, and he told me he'd ridden about 150 miles in the previous weeks without any problems.
Long story short.....I really don't want to waste a big chunk of the Summer sorting this bike out.......I'm 72 now so I want to enjoy the summer and my Hernia isn't helping either, so I think I'll just move it on and be straight with the prospective Buyer that it needs work to the engine. A shame really as it is a nice bike and the size and weight was just what I wanted after struggling with some big bikes over the last few years.
Thanks to all for your help.
Watch this space.
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I wonder if it's dislodged the baffle in the exhaust? LHS fall might do that.
If the bike was fixed, would you keep it?
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That's a K2 (ED, F, G) all right and it is beautiful. IMO it deserves the 4-4 exhausts. Yours has the rear pegs angled forward, like mine had when I got it. It facilitates lowering the pegs whilst riding, so on long rides you can change the position of your legs for a short period to fight muscle strain. I did this in the years I sometimes rode over 1000km a day.
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That's a K2 (ED, F, G) all right and it is beautiful. IMO it deserves the 4-4 exhausts. Yours has the rear pegs angled forward, like mine had when I got it. It facilitates lowering the pegs whilst riding, so on long rides you can change the position of your legs for a short period to fight muscle strain. I did this in the years I sometimes rode over 1000km a day.
I once did 995miles in 22 hours riding from the Pyrenees to York North Yorkshire. Absolutely never again….😢
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I once did 995miles in 22 hours riding from the Pyrenees to York North Yorkshire. Absolutely never again….😢
Homesick?
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No accommodation in France….anywhere >:(. D day celebrations.
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The front forks don't look right to me. The gaiters look like they are crunched up and there is not enough travel in the forks kind of thing. Could be because they changed the sliders?
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Intriguing observation. My K2 attached.
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It's 'scrunched up' because the Ratchet Straps are keeping the bike under tension on the Trailer.
I have put it for sale on 'Marketplace' at £3K and I'll see how it goes.....if it sells all well and good and if not, then Plan B !
I would keep it as it's a really nice bike...........easy to move around my garden, put on the centre stand and quite nippy and light on the road......I don't like skinny tyres or small BHP, but this is OK for me. I was in two minds about buying another big engined/ fat tyred bike, but the Hernia and advancing years are the deciding factors just now. I ain't planning on riding round the world, but if I thought I'd never ride another bike again, now that really would be a tragedy in my eyes, so if I can manage a blast around the local countryside now and then - when the sun shines and the bug bites, I'll happily settle for that.
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Yup, just noticed that in the photo.
Good luck with the sale. I’d be interested if I didn’t already have one. Would be good to get to the source of the problem though as an engine tear down and refurb could cost plenty!
I’d be inclined to fix it, keep it and take the benefit of your work?
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I'd keep it. This model - the last in old style - had all the necessary improvements, before that horrible K3 entered the scene. The tank striping is much nicer, at least more to my liking and it has the elegant tail light. Your bike deserves the original grabrail. A better than original repro (made in Italy) can be ordered at CMSNL.
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If the silencer comes away from the downpipes Alan I'd try running it like that to see if it is the baffle plate that become detached by the fall.
I think your giving up far too easily, it can't be a big problem if it was running ok before the fall.