Honda-SOHC
Other Stuff => Misc / Open => Topic started by: Lobo on January 12, 2014, 08:02:21 AM
-
Hi all,
A year + down the track from importing my Cb400F (from EIRE) I'm just about there.... BrianJ suggested a long while ago I post 'the experience' as may be of use. So here goes, and first up, a big thanks to Brian who was always quick with invaluable pm responses.
First up, I am not going into details of forms, because one thing I learned in the space of 12 months is how quickly the process can / does change. Bottom line, you've gotta keep your eye on the ball, and not assume things stay the way they were 6 months ago....
Whatever your plans for the bike (SORN, Long resto etc) you MUST inform HMRC <14 days of it arriving on-shore so that import duty can be assessed. Beware.... take longer than this & they are able to fine you £5/day for late paperwork.. ouch. The HMRC forms can be found on the Government Gateway website. (no tax applicable to my EU import)
DVLA cannot do anything until the bike has cleared customs... (HMRC inform the DVLA directly)
In my case a nuts & bolts resto was done, and so I stopped the admin process here & concentrated on the rebuild, ie no SORN, or road tax sought, indeed the bike sat in the garage uninsured for a year... if you'd wanted to steal it you'd have needed a skip anyways.
At completion of rebuild, in order for the DVLA to put the bike on the UK register it needed an MOT. This can be done without any insurance, and in my case I rang my local motorbike garage who do a bloody great £10 pick-up / drop off service in their Transit van & took the bike away. They then issued a valid MOT using the frame number... which is obviously read from the headstock (versus alloy plate) Tip - if you get the frame powder coated etc ensure the # still legible!
Next up you have to insure the bike < the DVLA will issue a V5C. Ring your insurance co with the frame #; and they will issue a one-off 30 day insurance certificate for registration purposes. DO NOT arrange this until you are ready to send off all the guff to DVLA due this short time-window. Furthermore, my insurance co (Footman James) told me only 3 such one-offs could be issued... unsure why.
Then get the correct DVLA Registration application form (V55C currently) & fill it in. Fairly straightforward, a lot of stuff about 'Cert of conformity'... which you can ignore if the bike > 10 yrs old. Bung the required £s for road tax, + £55 processing fee + previous foreign reg document + completed V55C + insurance cert + whatever else in an envelope to DVLA... and wait. (extremely bloody unhelpfully all district DVLA offices are now closed, leaving only Swansea. You cannot drive down there for a chat... no face-face facilities. They do however operate phone lines... the guy was quite helpful)
Note that DVLA are perfectly entitled to want to inspect the bike themselves... in which case (I guess) you're talking trailering the bloody thing to S.Wales. Lovely...
About 10 days later the V5C form arrived, with a registration year applicable to the year of build... my '77 bike has been allocated an 'R' plate. (and a Birmingham 'SOU' prefix - no idea why, but who cares?). And for some reason the 12 months tax disc has not been included...they wrote:
"There are currently changes taking place regarding the registration of imported vehicles within the DVLA. As a result of these changes in some cases our customers are receiving the V5C Registration Certificates before the replacement tax discs, MOT Certificates and V948 authorisation letters.
The new tax disc/MOT should arrive within 10 working days. If you do not receive these documents within this time please contact us."
....and this is where I am today..
Anyways, with the registration in hand, the last things to do are to take the V5C into (eg) Halfords & get a plate made up (take your drivers licence as proof of address)... and ring your insurance company to amend the frame # to number plate reg.
Tips...
(1) buy a bloody UK registered bike!
(2) if you buy an import get the HMRC sorted out ASAP.
(3) take your time here & enjoy the restoration.
(4) MOT the bike and register it all within 30 days
To fair, the process not insurmountable, and would not put me off buying a nice machine. (wouldn't swap mine now; I reckon it spent the first 25 years of its life in a sunny part of the 'States and was consequently in generally great condition throughout.)
Deviations from the above, eg no original paperwork (ie previous owners 'V5'); or modified bike I cannot comment upon.
Cheers,
Simon
-
Cheers for sharing your experience Lobo I'm sure others will find it useful ,
I've been through the process of getting a old Honda 750 registered on an age related plate that I bought with no documents or reg number,
Bryanj was very helpful for me to ;) cheers Mick.
-
Thanks for your comments folks, I have done, shall we say "A Few", and the documentation can get awkward, There is another way but I am not willing to put it up on the site!!! anybody who wants to know can PM to get a telephone contact number.
All the best
Bryan
-
Bryan,
In not so the near future can I expect all this nonsense when I bring my french k6 home?
Cheers
Bitsa
-
Bitsa, as it is in your name and in use in theory it ought to be easier, check on the DVLA.gov website for the paperwork to import a personal vehicle from the EU
-
Cheers Bryan will do
Bitsa
-
1971 Honda CL350
Lobo I know you have explained a lot of my question already, but someone on here may have some extra info to suit my situation?
Over the weekend I picked up a 1971 Honda CL350 Street Scrambler advertised on Done Deal in Southern Ireland. I live in the Northern Ireland.
Looks like I'm going down the same road as Lobo, but hopefully mine won't take a year to process!
The Honda was first imported from the U.S.A into Southern Ire 18 Nov 2005 and given the Irish registration number ZV 7893 (South Ire age related plate for 1971) Date of first taxed in Southern Ire OTR 12th Oct 2006. It wasn’t taxed this year but the owner said it was taxed a couple of years age.
The only documents I have for the CL350 is the Irish registration tax book, which states has all the above info.
Correct me if I’m wrong.
The first thing in need to do is inform HMRC (NOVA) I've imported a motorcycle from South Ire (one of the EU countries) into the North Ire within the next 14 days. They will hopefully add the CL350 onto their system and send me a reference number and in due course I take this to the DVLA as proof of all duty has been paid. Do I pay duty or Vat on a January 1971 Honda? Anybody know?
Ask recognised classic motor-vehicle club to issue age related certificate for Japanese motorcycle to help obtain a UK registration.
Not sure if I need this certificate, the info is on the Irish tax book?
Apply for an MOT using the Honda's frame number.
Only when it's cleared HMRC can I apply for a MOT?
Once passed take the MOT cert along with insurance, V55/5 form and a V3 form to DVLA (NI) who will issue a registration number.
I think the V3 form is only used in N Ireland?
We use a V3 when you applying for an age related number plate if the vehicle is imported from the EU into the North Ire? Anybody know?
One of my biggest concerns is when registering the Honda for the first with DVLA (NI) will they only issue a 2014 registration number or would I be issued an age related (1971) number? I hear there's no guarantees they will issue an age related number!
A 2014 issued registration number on a classic bike looks completely wrong.
Maybe I could register the Honda in Swansea? more chance of an age related plates!
Has any of the lads from the North (Ire) already gone down this road?
-
Don't forget Coleraine DVLC has been thinned out. You may have to deal with SWansea.
-
I was really hoping to get a Co Armagh number (my local) or at least a 71 age related Northern Ire plate. But if Coleraine is thinning i might end-up with a K reg.
A lot better than a new 2014 plate off the shelf!
-
Hi Oldiron.
Basically HMRC will decide whether duty is payable, but I'd be highly surprised if it were. Having processed your p'work they will advise the DVLA directly & advise you so, ie that you may proceed. No 'reference number' that I remember: just a note from them to say the DVLA advised.
Don't see why you need to ask any classic motor vehicle for an age related cert as you have the log book, AND the date of manufacture is stamped on the frame plate. (DVLA used this as my bike's reference for plate allocation)
Correct - get initial MOT based on frame #, and only when passed this apply to the DVLA (not HMRC as written) for registration into the system. This form is over the top with loadsa questions (eg on exhaust emissions blah blah... you can ignore these on a bike of your age)
I do not believe the DVLA WILL EVER issue a modern plate.... rather they'd issue a 'Q' plate if not furnished all the info they wanted. Assuming the old paperwork is on place, and the frame # matches it I'm 99% sure you'll be getting a rego in accordance with the date of manufacture stamped into the frame plate.
And nope, I didn't get a local plate at all; I live in Hampshire & was allocated a Birmingham reg.
Can't answer your thoughts if Swansea, but would doubt it if there is a NI office avail.
Cheers,
Lobo
-
Lobo am I right saying I can apply for the MOT now before I get any reference from HMRC to proceed?
-
Yes you can do the MOT BUT if you want to rude it there you need insurance and on the mainland they charge for a year but it will only last 30 days on a frame number then you "Loose" the money, so if you are insistent i would trailer or van the bike to the MOT
-
My insurance company (Footman James) would only give me 30 days insurance cover if using the frame #. I work abroad, with time tight in the UK asked "what if it fails the MOT & I don't have time for attempt #2 within the month? Answer was that only 3 such insurance periods would be tolerated.... after that they were at a loss at obviously it is way outside of the norm.
As for doing the MOT < HMRC pass on details to the DVLA I'll sit on the fence, as at that point in time no details of your bike will exist within the DVLA database. Common sense / Bryan say yes... but I'm so bloody suspicious of pen-pushers & their "computer says no" crap these days. My thoughts are "what's the point.... it's not as if you'll be able to enjoy the bike any sooner, and its annual MOT clock will be ticking away sooner, rather than later"
As for riding it directly to the MOT centre with no number plate..... I was told "no problem" by my garage, so long as you can prove the booking, are taking the shortest route & have the all important insurance cover. I took Bryan's advice & had my garage collect it / drop it off at a highly reasonable £15 .... thus able to delay buying insurance cover by a few more weeks.
Good luck,
Simon
-
Yes, it is true. You can ride your bike to a mot station without displaying a registration number (number plate). I ride bikes round with my trade plate strapped to the tank. Boy's in blue love that one. The cop's also hate the fact that you can MOT a M/C for day time use only. ie, no head light or tail light needed. You do need a brake light and can get away with a cycle horn . I have heard that they are trying to do away with day time use only. That will upset my mate that still rides his KX250 on that law.
The trike law is also changing at the moment, more complicated and get rid of some of the loopholes.
-
Trigger do you know what is changing on the trikes as we have to get my mates done soon after finding that the "proffessionals" who built the rear end needed stringing up by their tackle as it was so crap you wouldn't belive---nice paint tho
-
No changes finalized at the moment. The whisper is it will be around August. I know that they are trying to do away with hard tails but, not 100% sure if that will apply to trikes, bikes or what yet. You should know what the ministry are like Bryan.
They are under attack from Europe on indicators, In most parts of Europe/ Germany a trike has to have a front indicator bar/stem the width of the trike. The UK are saying that this makes the trike dangerous to pedestrian.
-
Just thought I'd add my trials to this...
I'm in the middle of registering an imported cb450 at the mo.
All mot'd insured etc. (footman James seem happy to roll the insurance as long as I notify them every 2 weeks to allow for unforeseen circumstances ........just as bloody well!!!!! )
It was imported pre NOVA so I rang HMRC to clarify the situation and they said because it was pre NOVA that i could send the C&E389 (previously tax paid cert) to DVLA...
So I contacted DVLA to clarify they agreed and also said because its a 1971 bike no first tax needed paying? Great..
Well this week I had a letter from DVLA declining application as I needed a NOVA stamp on C&E389 and to include £58 for first tax???
So all paper work is now winging it to Dover to hopefully get the correct NOVA approval ...the only saving grace Is I now have the girls direct contact at DVLA so I have someone who can help and possibly know what the hell is going
Because it seems to me no one else know their arse from their elbow and it all falls down to who's desk the paper work lands on...
The next thing I will need to do no doubt is take the bike to VOSA to prove it exists. Even with an MOT and original USA title
Its winding me up writing this....
Time out!
-
The money DVLA want is not the Tax, its they fact they charge you for a first registration wether its new or used mate.
-
No they want about £75 for first registration...which I included in the first application. And then they wanted £50 odd quid for first tax. ? Definitely...
If I remember correctly they also done this with a tribsa I had but they returned the cheque with the paper work...
It's probably just a load of tick boxes they need to fill in
-
Just going to correct myself
Just checked DVLA forms
I enclosed the £55 first registration fee not £75 as I quoted above...
And they also said quote
"the correct rate of tax disc was not enclosed please enclose the correct rate of tax of £58."
Even though its a 71" bike and the guy at the DVLA office said I didn't need to send it?
So it's £55 first reg fee
And £57 for first tax disc
I will get there
-
I thought the reg fee was £65 now
-
This is exactly it.....who knows???
The first thing I did before I filled out the V55/5 was to call DVLA to check on the correct paper work to send them ...and fees...
And then rang HMRC regards NOVA
Attached is a pic of returned letter and the DVLA check list at the bottom of the v55/5
All correct it seems apart from NOVA and tax fee?..
Which I was told neither apply?.???
It's a long winded process at best but being told one thing and then a week later the goal posts are moved it gets a tad annoying ...and I just know the next thing is a trip to VOSA to have the numbers checked
-
I would be ringing and reminding them that the Tax is Zero and they told you Nova did not apply. Also a visit to check numbers did not happen if the Proof of year of build was a letter from Honda when i did a few
-
Just keeping everyone up-to date on the import process of my Honda.
Brief history.
1971 CL350K3 Street Scrambler.
Imported from U.S to South of Ireland 2005.
Bought the Honda and took her home to Northern Ireland 12th April 2014.
The only document I have is a S Ireland tax book.
Stage1 HMR&C (SORTED)
Used the HMR&C (NOVA) online service. Very easy to use with immediate reply.
Date Created:18 Apr 2014 Name: Damian C. Acknowledgement reference: 4CSJ -------------
Re: Online Notification of Vehicle Arrivals (NOVA) submission
Submission reference: 4CSJ-----------
NOVA reference: NOVA15E------
VIN: CL350-------
Thank you for your vehicle notification.
Based on the information you have provided to HMRC, an application can now be made to register and licence the vehicle with Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA). Please note that certain vehicle information will be shared with DVLA for registration and licensing purposes.
HMRC have reviewed your vehicle notification and are satisfied that no VAT is due.
You should allow 48 hours from the time you receive this notice before applying to DVLA.
Stage 2 (SORTED)
Notified insurance (25th April) and added the CL350 onto my policy.
Insured for thirty days on its chassis number.
Stage 3 (SORTED)
MOT was booked on its chassis number and passed OK on the 26th April.
Now at Stage 4.
To obtain an Age related Registration in N.I. i need to complete and supply the following documents to The Association of Old Vehicle Clubs in N.I.
V3 and V55/5 form, MOT, insurance, Irish Registration book, cheque for £75 made out to AOVC and cheque for £55 made out to DVLA.
All originals of above go to the address at the top of the V3 Form. An Inspector will then phone me to make an appointment to inspect the bike at my home.
They normally do the inspection within days of receiving the paperwork and process this inside 48 hours.
It can then take DVLA in Coleraine (N.I.) anything from 7 days to several weeks to allocate the number depending on how busy they are.
Hopefully by the May I will have the Honda registered with a N.I. age related.
-
8 long weeks and I've finally been issued a N Ireland (Co Down) age related plate for the 1971 CL350 dare I say it Twin!
-
Well done... finally... it really is a frustrating and needlessly complicated process.
DVLA continue to frustrate the **** out of me. My '73 750 is now classed as 'historic', and consequently free of road tax. So, I go onto the (slick) tax website and try to register / get the annual new tax disc (£0).... nope... gotta call them. 30 mins of frigging automated call centre crap / holding... whereupon I'm told to amend the V5 to 'Historic' and send it them.
I do.... 5 weeks later it comes back unchanged and a letter saying "we can't process this because your bike is not taxed. You need to go to a PO & tax it, and then send us the tax disc # and PO where you did this. Aaargh!
So I go to the PO wondering just how I was going to get a Historic Tax disc.... thank god a knowledgeable lady was on duty. "The DVLA don't have a clue what they're doing" (she told me).
Anyways, a new tax disc @ £0, and best of all she kept the bloody V5... to process with DVLA.
The BIG question... why did these clowns just not amend my V5, and issue me a free tax disc. Why did the PO have to be involved... what was all the bloody point?
As I say....aaargh...
-
Well.... I was going to say try your local DVLA office. I went to mine in order to get "disabled" status removed from a car I bought at auction a while back, since it seemed the only way out of a similar "deadly embrace".
However... they have all been closed https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/250142/INF259_151013.pdf
So online/press-2-for.... it is then