Post by: Craizeehair on August 20, 2023, 09:59:38 PM
Today was to be the day that I checked the points and set the ignition timing, for the first time. I hadn’t banked on the timing being so much of a pain!
The points are pretty much cooked and I will be ordering new ones but I cleaned them up for now, set the gaps and cracked on with the timing. This is where the fun started.
I could set the timing on 1-4 to light the bulb bang on the F mark.
If I then set the plate with one screw to check it, everything was fine, as soon as I tightened all three screws it would throw it out. This went on for about an hour, what I found was that if I tightened the top right screw on the plate at any point it went out of whack. If I tightened one of the other screws, or both of them, it was fine. As soon as the top right screw was tightened it advanced it.
Is there a knack that I don’t know about. Could the plate be dodgey, or any other issue that could cause this? I didn’t expect it to be such a pain.
Post by: Oddjob on August 20, 2023, 10:13:09 PM
It's common when non original points are fitted to find timing 2-3 difficult, with TEC points it's a doddle but not stuff like Daichi.
Original points are very expensive and can be hard to find.
Post by: Craizeehair on August 20, 2023, 10:19:10 PM
Possible the plate is bent, take it off and check it.Thanks, I did wonder if the plate might be the problem.
It's common when non original points are fitted to find timing 2-3 difficult, with TEC points it's a doddle but not stuff like Daichi.
Original points are very expensive and can be hard to find.
I am going to order new points anyway and I’m sure the condensers are after market so had contemplated changing them for originals whilst I’m at it. DS sells the original plate with points and condensers already fitted, cheaper than buying the points and condensers separately, not cheap but I may go that way for peace of mind?
Post by: Bryanj on August 20, 2023, 10:27:08 PM
Post by: Martin6 on August 20, 2023, 10:27:53 PM
Post by: Bryanj on August 20, 2023, 10:28:45 PM
Post by: Craizeehair on August 20, 2023, 10:29:41 PM
You are tightening up 1 & 4, to lock them in, before moving to 2 & 3?Yes, when I tighten the top right screw on the plate for 1-4, that’s what knocks it out of alignment.
Post by: Craizeehair on August 20, 2023, 10:31:32 PM
The other thing to check is that the shaft is running true, they can easily be bent a fraction if you turn the engine over with the big nut on the advancerSounds more serious than a new plate! What’s the best way to check that?
Post by: Martin6 on August 20, 2023, 10:34:50 PM
Ah, got it. 👍You are tightening up 1 & 4, to lock them in, before moving to 2 & 3?Yes, when I tighten the top right screw on the plate for 1-4, that’s what knocks it out of alignment.
Post by: Oddjob on August 21, 2023, 05:48:37 AM
Possible the plate is bent, take it off and check it.Thanks, I did wonder if the plate might be the problem.
It's common when non original points are fitted to find timing 2-3 difficult, with TEC points it's a doddle but not stuff like Daichi.
Original points are very expensive and can be hard to find.
I am going to order new points anyway and I’m sure the condensers are after market so had contemplated changing them for originals whilst I’m at it. DS sells the original plate with points and condensers already fitted, cheaper than buying the points and condensers separately, not cheap but I may go that way for peace of mind?
I'm not 100% sure that what DS are selling are the original points and condensers. Check first before buying. The originals are clearly marked TEC.
Post by: Trigger on August 21, 2023, 06:57:57 AM
Post by: Bryanj on August 21, 2023, 07:45:14 AM
The shaft screws into the crank with an O ring to seal oil
Post by: Oddjob on August 21, 2023, 05:33:39 PM
The original 70's points plate for a 750 was Hitachi and was marked by the Hitachi logo and had ND points and condensers
As you can no longer find that part number, 30200-300-005, and even IF you could DS would be charging a fortune for it as it would be labelled "Sandcast" and we all know that doubles the price of it. So for all intents and purposes it's the TEC version that he requires, unfortunately DS has a nasty habit of not updating his pics, so he shows what they should look like and then sends something else. The replacement plate is made by Daichi and when you search for the part number of the plate 30200-300-154 that's what you normally get offered. Unless you know, you're liable to buy it thinking it's genuine. Then you find out it isn't, as it's a bitch to get timed up.
Forewarned is forearmed as they say.
Post by: Craizeehair on August 21, 2023, 05:51:13 PM
On the off chance, does anyone know where I would be able to get the TEC version if needed?
Post by: Oddjob on August 21, 2023, 05:58:42 PM
Post by: Bryanj on August 21, 2023, 06:07:45 PM
Post by: Craizeehair on August 24, 2023, 03:56:15 PM
Is there any particular lubricant that I should use for the felt?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230824/509f86ee45ab2e5404600e5c3c27c0fc.jpg)
Post by: Oddjob on August 24, 2023, 04:00:37 PM
Post by: Craizeehair on August 24, 2023, 06:11:27 PM
I use silicon oil. Very versatile oil.I have some of that
Post by: Craizeehair on August 29, 2023, 10:15:20 PM
I fitted the new points plate over the weekend, set points gap and static timing along with new plugs and caps and set the valve clearances. There is a definite improvement, before there was a very distinct flat spot, this is much better now.
All I need now is to muster up the courage to do my first ever carb work!
Post by: Trigger on August 29, 2023, 11:38:50 PM
Post by: Bryanj on August 29, 2023, 11:42:31 PM
Post by: Craizeehair on September 05, 2023, 10:20:28 AM
I was also going to check the valve clearances again and maybe see if I can get my hands on a compression tester.
Looking through the book, the engine tune up lists the tasks in order, would this be the best and recommended order to carry out these checks…
Ignition timing and points gap, tappet clearance then can chain adjustment?
The air filter is new and the carbs are going to wait until the weather turns.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230905/d4868b9fc08d6837af241510c856be86.jpg)
Post by: Oddjob on September 05, 2023, 01:40:45 PM
Firs thing we did was drop the oil and filter and that way it was draining as you worked on the rest.
Post by: Craizeehair on September 05, 2023, 01:52:45 PM
Much appreciated.
Post by: Craizeehair on September 07, 2023, 06:26:32 PM
The effort to set points gap at 14 thou and get the timing spot on the F is worth it but do keep rechecking it as moving the plate alters the gap and altering the gap moves the timing so takes a lot of care and time as a novice but well worth itThanks for this advice, I finally got round to checking it again today and it wasn’t exactly where it should be. As you say, adjusting one threw others out and I hadn’t realised.
I spent what felt like an age, adjusting and setting points gaps and the timing marks on the F marks. I just couldn’t get 1-4 and 2-3 all adjusted bang on correctly at the same time.
As you rightly said it was a lot of care and time as a novice, although I did get there in the end.
But by ‘eck… was it worth it! A marked difference, the bike is running so much better.
Tick over when warm is now so much better, it used to tick over very low, perhaps 700-850 rpm. Now a steady 1050 rpm I would say, which also makes it sound so much better.
It has opened up more at higher revs and higher speeds, it always felt restricted approaching 60-65mph and never really hitting the higher revs comfortably, tonight she ran like a top.
Thanks for the help and advice all.
Post by: Trigger on September 07, 2023, 06:36:26 PM
Post by: Craizeehair on September 07, 2023, 06:52:15 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230907/c8415776257a18aca92ede9ee2ee6025.jpg)
Post by: Trigger on September 07, 2023, 06:59:20 PM
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on September 08, 2023, 09:40:33 AM
Post by: Craizeehair on September 08, 2023, 09:53:48 AM
Post by: Johnny4428 on September 08, 2023, 11:09:20 AM