Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => Project Board => Topic started by: yozzer74 on February 15, 2015, 07:57:25 PM
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Started my cafe racer build thought I would share some pictures
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F's make the best cafe racers
Looks like you had a wee leak
Mick
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Bike was running .but leaking oil from head gasket.yes just a little leak lol .thought I had drained all oil out but obviously not
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I have been looking round for breaks off cb900f finally got some .there a straight swap .had them powder coated
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Had a cafe seat made and a hoop put on
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Got some rear set's just need to make some brackets up also had head light bucket hydro dipped
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"Hydro dipped"... ??
As an old fashioned engineer, I translate that as giving it a wash...
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Ha ha
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Its going to look great yozzer, keep the pictures coming
pee
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Thanks Pete I will try probably be a bit slow .but I will get there
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hey yozzer, you aint seen slow till you have seen me, i still have unfinished projects from the nineties, and i am not kidding
pete
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Ha ha sound like my dad he's been doing a bsa gold flash since1982 lol hope I'm a bit quicker than that
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I'm thinking of having a tank made like this .what do you all think .or should I stay with stock tank .I'm thinking the money I would spend on painting will pay for tank .
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Go for it,
are they the tanks from India?
pete
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No Pete there's a guy near me who makes them .it's same bloke who made seat
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Tank looks great, out of interest how much are they?
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He charges 400 takes him about a week to make
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"Hydro dipped"... ??
As an old fashioned engineer, I translate that as giving it a wash...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8wHglTJl6A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8wHglTJl6A) found this
and this
http://www.wickedcoatings.co.uk/hydro-dipping (http://www.wickedcoatings.co.uk/hydro-dipping)
Not come across before- every day is a school day ???
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Thats really neat, a new one on me as well
pete
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I had mine done at hydroprecision in Rotherham there cheaper than wicked .the different patterns you can have are endless .
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Swallow sprays in Windsor does hydrodipping as well, but can't speak from first hand experience.
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Forgot to say on the phone Yozzer. Any short cuts on a engine build will bite you back. Re-place the stopper in the oil pump as std. With new rings you have to cross hatch the bores or you will have a nice polished effect.
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Ok cheers for advice .
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Here you go. The best vid that was not american > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xy_g1rG7mKQ
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Ha yes I'm with you now
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I ordered an exhaust from the US it's been in customs clearance for 3 days now in the UK .does anyone no how long it takes to get through it
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I ordered an exhaust from the US it's been in customs clearance for 3 days now in the UK .does anyone no how long it takes to get through it
The longer it take, the bigger the customs bill ;D Upto a week.
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I new it would take longer to get from London than it did from California.
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I ordered an exhaust from the US it's been in customs clearance for 3 days now in the UK .does anyone no how long it takes to get through it
The longer it take, the bigger the customs bill ;D Upto a week.
It's why I'm opting to have one made here. Customs fees and duty were killer!
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I ordered an exhaust from the US it's been in customs clearance for 3 days now in the UK .does anyone no how long it takes to get through it
The longer it take, the bigger the customs bill ;D Upto a week.
It's why I'm opting to have one made here. Customs fees and duty were killer!
Did i not explain on how to get away with it ;)
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No I did not see that the shop I got it from said he would help on customs form .don't no if he can he said something about marking it down has 75 dollars .and put it down as returned goods .Do you think I will get away with it
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No I did not see that the shop I got it from said he would help on customs form .don't no if he can he said something about marking it down has 75 dollars .and put it down as returned goods .Do you think I will get away with it
If we dont see any posts from you for 3 months, we will have the answer ;D
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Ha ha it was ant me sir
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Got a few more bits hydro dipped hoping exhaust is here tomorrow
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pipes came this morning
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They no what there for .I'm getting some engine casing done in same pattern .they say it's good up to 400 degrees .there engine brackets.What I've had done the price for brackets and the rear master cylinder cap was 15 pounds.you can send parts in by post to them .and the little badges for wheels were 15 pounds I had 30 of them done has I had some spare .
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Got my tank back today few pictures
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Looks great! Exciting to see things start coming together.
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Yeah it is going to crack on with engine now
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Yeah it is going to crack on with engine now
Just rebuilt my top end this past weekend. Feels nice tightening those cover bolts and knowing it's all fresh inside. Now its wheels and frame for me.
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What did you do to it
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Cleaned and painted the barrels, head cam cover and breather cover. Polished all the side covers. New rings, valve seats cut, valves lapped in, ports gas flowed, skimmed the head, new gaskets and reassembled with stainless hardware.
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What paint did you use
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On Trig's advice, I used Simoniz SIMVHT31C and then baked the parts for 90 mins after they were dry. Seemed to go really well, and does t come off so far with oil or a bit of carb cleaner.
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Had a go at wheels today to see if they looked ok with just spokes painted .rims polished think I'm going to go with it .I will get them powder coated .
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Shame Yozzer I like them like that real smart and different
Cheers
Bitsa
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changed my mind about wheels just went for full powder coat. Had fork lowers done too.+ a few other bits .also had to get some valve guides mine were pretty badly worn .started detabing frame today .
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Has anyone ever fitted these valve guides before
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heat up the head and they will come out quite easily, but make sure you get any carbon of the bottom as it can score up the head as you push out, you have to ream the guides and recut the seats as well
pete
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Yeah think I'm going to let local engineering shop do them for me
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Looking good!
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Cheers
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How's your bike going mate
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Got my wheels done too, need to snap a pic of those! Frorks are rebuilt, and the lower triple tree, swingarm and some bits off to the powdercoater, coming back Wednesday. Hoping I'll have a roller shortly and then off to have the exhaust built. The fellas at the shop said the probably won't get to it until August though. On hold again!
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When you aiming for it being done what colour you had wheels done
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I'm aiming for completion by next May (budget constraints). Wheels are DID chrome rims, stainless spokes and polished hubs.
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Rubber is Avon roadrider
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Nice that's when I'm aiming for same restraints lol
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Nowt to do with bike but fitted this today so I can work on bike over winter . Also does anyone no how I move this thread to project's page thanks
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You cant move it yourself. You will need to send a PM to admin Steve.
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I'll do it. But currently in back garden listening to Monaco GP on my phone.
Can't move threads from my phone.
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Ok cheers
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Finally got my head back .valve guides fitted& head skimmed &seaats recut & lapped .but one of the exhaust valves is bent .so need to find one from some were .also got my yoke back from being welded up after cutting the bar mounts off.
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i might have a second hand valve, i will take a look monday when i am home if you want, might need to remind me
pete
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Ok cheers Pete will do
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Drilled my disc think holes need to be bigger or some more drilling
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It's a matter of personal preference, I would wait until it's fitted to the finished bike and see how it looks, it's easy to put more holes in but much harder to take them out again!😀
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Yeah I think your right
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Unless you've got an adding -on bit
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What do you mean adding on bit
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Is that what the reverse function on my cordless drill is for?
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Hi Pete did you manage to find a spare valve .cheers .
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Few more bits back took some pics in Sun to see how they would pop with metal flake in them .I've been buying titanium race bolts just a few at a time got nearly all of the engine brackets bolts chain guard and the break calipers yokes break arm bolts not many more to get now thank God.I'm not doing it for weight savings .I just like the look of them
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Also got a new rear master cylinder off a Ducati panagali hope it works ??
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Been cleaning engine parts today noticed this on bottom of barrels it's quite deep anyone got any ideas what has caused it and will it be ok.and how I can stop it .thanks
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Hi Yozzer,
Excellent café racer resto,
I have just stripped an F2 for the first time, the engine has the exact same indentation!
I have worked on dozens of 750k and F1 engines, never seen it before...
Nigel
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Yeah I asked carpy if it was a comon thing he said it was don't no if it's anything to worry about or how to fix
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Its where the top of the cushion is not held tight at the head gasket so it can float up and down a fraction meaning the steel pin wears the flat surface. Not a huge problem unless the indentation is deep, which i have seen. Check the top ears for wear as I have seen one where they broke off
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Will do the indentations are deep should I see about getting them welded up if that's possible
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Got my discs painted up and my yoke back from powder coating.I'm happy how it turned out.decided to go back to black with cam cover. thought I had too many different colours going on.with the engine .also took my frame to one off welding in Barnsley .he's making me an alloy oil tank
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Thats looking good
pete
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Cheers Pete and thanks again for the valve
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Picked my oil tank up today from Paul at one off welding and engineering.What a job he's made of it .pictures didn't do it justice ..[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Very Bling 8) I wont ask what it cost.
Mick
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Yeah we will keep that quiet especially from the wife !!
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Started dry building bike today.[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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][attachimg=1]
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that is sooooo cool!
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Cheers
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Looking good, keep the photos coming
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That is really special alloy work. Whoever did that is an artist.
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Couple more [attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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That is looking really good, excellent quality of work.
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Oooooooh the Oil Tank is wonderful. I particularly like the side indents and strengthening ribs from corner to corner. Keep the photos coming please as it looks like it's going to be a fantastic bike.
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Got my seat pan back from powder coating today .it's off to be upholstered tomorrow
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Got my service kit for oil pump from trigger
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Had a go at making some templates for rear sets brackets today .think they look ok [attach=1][attach=2][attach=3]
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Disaster does anyone no if this is fixable.
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Nightmare - never tried the system myself but the laser tools aluminium repair system may be an option - take a look at the video on the product page.
http://www.lasertools.co.uk/item.aspx?item=4197
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Cheers for that I will look in to it can't believe my look some times
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To be honest I would say its not fixable mate
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I may be saved been speaking to a guy in holand he makes these oil filters to eliminate the old ones he says he will make a longer adaptor to reach the good threads inside [attachimg=1]
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i like the mdf rearsets! very cool. if you need a flashier brake pedal, i have a gilles one going spare.
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Are there no Aluminium Welders near you? I had a T120 with broken crankcases - at the front where the mounting bolt goes through. Spent ages trying to find a good Aluminium Welder......after a year a chance remark from my Neighbour found a great fella only 10 miles from me.....problem solved. I know that you would have to strip the engine out and recut the thread for the oil filter......but its better than scrapping the complete motor. P.S. How on earth did that damage occur?
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Don't no how it happened when I removed oil filter today I noticed it had a crack in it so I just touched it and it fell off .the guy that made my oil tank is going to have a look at it to see what he can do .fingers crossed .
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Been a while since I updated build just been buying parts .but got my oil filter& adapter form voxonda in Holland and.also got my seat back from upholstery .love it .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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Oil filter kit
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That seat is mint, despite it being black!
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Thanks he's made a good job of it worth the wait
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Can´t help wonder how will it feel to sit on that oil filler cap?
Or is it just me siting close on the petrol tank?
Been on a Seeley since ´78. Even with the short 19 litre tank
Though with original oil tank.
Erling.
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Uncomfortable but it looks good lol .No oil cap is between your legs but can't feel it but there int much padding so will have a sore bottom after a few miles .
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Its starting to looks fabulous Yozzer, nice one. Don't take it out in the rain though or you will be on the Solvol Autosol for the rest of your life. ;D
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Does anyone have any idea what size batterie I should be looking for I want to locate it under seat. So size could be an issue .Cheers Mike
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I did a bit of reading around the topic, and found a few posts that showed that generally honda decreased the cca by 25% for kick only models, so if you don't use the starter you can drop down a bit. I decided to relocate mine under the swingarm, but fixed to the frame. Gave me enough space to fit a 9Ah motobatt. Hasn't been tried and tested yet, but can keep you updated.
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Thanks yes please do .I am wanting to use starter
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Will be a few weeks yet. Bike is in having an exhaust fabbed, then comes wiring, strip down, paint and powder. Hope to have it up and running by Feb.
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Are you doing a build thread for yours
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I haven't done one to be honest, I didn't really intend on doing much special, but it's started to have a mind of its own... last pic I have is below. Now has custom battery box, headlamp and fixings, clubman bars, and a few other bits. Will have a nice stainless 4-1 exhaust shortly too, and a custom speedo and mount.
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Looks well that mate what seat you going for are those batteries a little smaller than standard ones
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I'm doing a brat style seat with a kick up at the back. Sewed it out of calfskin myself this summer.
The battery is a bit smaller than standard, L: 5.91 (150) W: 2.76 (70) H: 4.13 (105). It's motobatt mbt9b4.
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Cheers for the measurements.have you got a picture of seat
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Unfortunately not. Will try to get a few once I've riveted it to the pan.
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Feeling happier now the problem with my engine is sorted .the oil filter kit adaptor wouldn't screw in .so ordered a tap for the threads .came to day cleaned threads with tap .adaptor goes straight in now [attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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Oil filter attached [attachimg=1]
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WOW yozzer, your build is looking stunning, i have a couple of F1,s to do one will be standard , the other is going to be cafed, but i will be on a much tighter budget so whatever fits will do, just remembered i still have an F2 cafe racer to finish it is buried under boxes down the side of my garage , looking at your bike really makes me want to crack on and get something done, well done so far the bike is so cool
pete
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Thanks Pete . :)
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Reading this has sparked my enthusiasm again Thanks Yozzer, your build id looking great.
Where did you get the head work done, that's all I need to be able to put my F2 motor back together and drop the frame over it, iirc you're in Barnsley aren't you, I'm only down the road on the outskirts of Sheffield.
I'm going pretty much the same look, everything will be either black or polished alloy, using the same brakes but with spoke wheels, back from an F1, front is Suzuki, both with flanged Borani rims.
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Here you go r1 Pete [attach=1]
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Hi yozzer, just finished the seat so figured I'd send a pic or two.(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/21/513f1c4c658b6dd28064efb97e3520bd.jpg)(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/21/0689391102b2b0339e9c855984c9960d.jpg)
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Nice you've made a rite job of that have you done owt like that before ..
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No, first go, but did a lot of reading and I've done some sewing before. Leather was tough though, not easy stuff to work with. Have to tip my hat to professional upholsterers.
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Well you've done well I like the double stitching on sides
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Thanks!
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Lovely build!
Like the tanks and seat hump, your alloy guy is a star.
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Fitted my oil pump service kit today went ok but not sure if I put the plunger back in the right way .picture of the way I installed it [attachimg=1]
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Also thought I would start to clean and polish & paint my rear shocks made a spring compressor to get springs off
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Nice work on the shock compressor
pete
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Plunger is correct
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I fitted that oil pump kit too from Elan? It works well and no oil drains into sump overnight
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Finished rear shocks today couple of before&after pics [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Also got my reset brackets made by Paul at one off welding fantastic job as usual [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Wow it must be costing a fair bit with all these one off goodies, i have just started a F1 cafe racer myself, but i am on a real tight budget,
i get lots of inspiration from your build, keep up the good work
pete
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Cheers Pete is it the one you started a while ago or was that a f2
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Looking forward to the finished machine, excellent work yozzer.
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Cheers Pete is it the one you started a while ago or was that a f2
The one i started about 4 years ago was an F2, i still have that one , but i never finished it, the one i have just started is an F1 , when there is something worth showing i will post up some pictures, i have done the wheels, and have a nice ally tail/seat and front guard, i am just filling in the tank where the badges go, it will be all silver, and black,
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How many bikes do you have Pete .look forward to seeing it .
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About 20 yozzer
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What all Hondas or a mixture
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Sandcast
K0
F2
f1x2
GPZ550X3
K1
f2 CAFE
klr600 x 3
KLR 650 Tengai
Honda vtx 1300
FZ1 1000
Rickman Z1R 1000
Honda ST70
Italjet 50 x2
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You must have a decent size garage
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They are all over the place even in the loft, most are in boxes, about 8 are rolling
The VTX1300 is on the road so is the fz1, and one of the klr,s,
Believe it or not i actually sold off about 5 last winter, cause i had problems, but all is good at the moment and i am living and breathing bikes, i wake up thinking of bikes, and go to sleep thinking of them, sad but true
pete
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Lol that's like me all I think about is my bike
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Nice to hear your enthusiasm for the bikes is back Pete. Really pleased.
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Yes james i am back in the game, one thing is for sure i will never tire of riding them, i started when i was 14 and will go to my grave with a bike, its an obsession for life, however when i have done the sandcast and k0 i dont think i will ever bother doing a restoration again, it is way to expensive and stressful
pete
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Does anyone know if a f1 rear wheel would fit into f2 .
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Caliper mounts are different and i think the disc is too
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Thanks
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Long shot this but does anyone no the thread pitch and size of the fork top bolts .I think there 28 mm & 1.5 pitch .would just like someone to confirm .has I'm having some preload adjusters made .
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Do you mean the fork tube top plug/bolts which hold the spring in? If you don't get a reply sooner I can pop the thread gauge on one tonight and let you know what size it is.
Alternatively a standard M8 bolt is 1.25mm pitch and should mesh correctly if you hold the two threads side by side, just leaves the diameter.
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Cheers yeah the ones that hold springs in
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Does anyone know if a f1 rear wheel would fit into f2 .
Yes, but, the F2 swing arm is wider so you need to mix and match parts as follows:
Everything F1 except the following from the F2
Sprocket carrier, this is wider on the F2.
The bearing spacer which sits inside the sprocket carrier, is also longer on the F2.
The wheel spindle, again is longer.
Our builds are very similar we ought to meet up some time....
Cheers.
Pete.
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The fork tops are 28 x 1.5 mm
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Thanks r1 Pete that's what size I thought .I'm getting ready for building my engine back up if you fancy giving me a hand :P ;D
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Well Christmas came early today got some new tappit covers off the wife .Well that's how I got away with buying them .and a few other new parts [attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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The head gasket came today do we think it is genuine also got some genuine inlet rubbers[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Got my frame back today battery box made + brackets made and fitted for master cylinder reservoir & regulator rectifier.New engine bolts made out of stainless .but kept swing arm one and the one that olds the rear set hanger on .but had stainless caps fitted in each end so they don't rust and match the colour of the titanium nuts .also had engine bracket drilled & steering lock removed .[attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Some pics of rear sets on frame [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Steering lock removed and drilled engine bracket[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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How did you find genuine F2 carb rubbers. That's got to be the find of the century.
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Ha ha it was a bit strange I was looking at carb rubbers on David silver's site. That state after market.then one time I went on is site and the after market ones where still there but it was all so showing a genuine set of 4 .??? So I bought them .which where actually cheaper than the others .work that one out .
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Amazing build Yozzer,
Nice neat electrics in the back of frame, looking forward to the completed machine.
Nigel
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Cheers Nigel
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Yes A great build, very impressive,
You were lucky with the inlet rubbers, i have only ever seen two sets come up for sale, and i bought one , they cost me a whopping £125 plus 12 pound postage, mind you silvers aftermarket ones are about the same pricing and there not all that apparently
pete
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I think his were 120 for the set .these were 112 for set ? Work that one out .
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Frame at powder coating just been blasted .[attachimg=1]
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I think his were 120 for the set .these were 112 for set ? Work that one out .
NOS but they don't realize the rarity ... done it loads of times with them. Like NOS fork ears for a CB350K0 for £6
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Frame back from powder coating let the fun begin :D[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Few more[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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New bushes fitted in swing arm [attach=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Now the bronze ones same way of flitting them threaded bar two washers & nuts and pressed them in .also fitted bobins for paddock stand .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Few pics of rubber caps & grommets on battery box and inner mud guard caps are to cover bolts up and access for fitting seat [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Few more [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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That's it for now hope I'm not boring anyone with all these pictures ;)
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keep pictures coming, amazing build you are doing
pete
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That's it for now hope I'm not boring anyone with all these pictures ;)
Never get bored of people"s rebuilds, and you are certainly making a great job on yours. Not everybody's taste I know, but your bike is every bit as special as some of the guys on here trying to restore to factory spec. While people spend loafd of time and money hunting elusive N.O.S. parts, whereas you have an equally hard job sourcing parts you need for your one off machine!
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Its really starting to look stunning now. Cant wait to see the finished bike.
Never boring, we love picture books on here. Its the reading we struggle with. ;D
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Ha it's writing I struggle with lol that's why so many pictures
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Great Project Yozzer..........keep the photees coming please.......just think of them as 'Yozzer's Christmas cards to members of the SOHC Forum'.
Like others, I can't wait to see the finished bike, and whatever kind or style of bike we prefer as individuals, the great thing about this Forum is that there is genuine interest in someone trying something new or different.
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+1 mate keep em coming ..love other folks resto threads.
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+2. Wot he said
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+3 from me.
Café racers aren't my preferred style of bike either but it's brilliant to see the amount of work and attention to detail going in to this build.
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Thanks everyone for the comments .it's nice to know people .like what your building .whether it's your style of bike or not .I no I enjoy following other people's builds .
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Bit more done today new steering bearing fitted & valves fitted back into head .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/big-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)
(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/big-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)
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I fitted that oil pump kit too from Elan? It works well and no oil drains into sump overnight
Do you by any chance have the details of this kit. Web address, part numbers etc. Been searching for these parts for 12 months now. Thanks.
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I got them off trigger on here give him a pm .
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Cheers Yozzer will send him a PM. May wait a week or so as they don't have internet at the moment.
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Hi Roy........if you can, please get one for the CB750 motor as well........
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Hi Roy........if you can, please get one for the CB750 motor as well........
That's the one I'm really after Alan. Gave up on doing mine as I couldn't find the parts and its not really bad enough to be worth doing now.
Will do yours whilst the engine is apart if Trigger can come through. Cheers Roy.
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I've got a couple of questions about the engine .the studs in the head are in tight do I need to get them out and put thread sealant on them .next does anyone no what goes in these holes if it's a notch pin do I need them because they weren't there when I stripped engine thanks [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Those studs should already been sealed but are prone to leaking if some one has removed them in the past so probably worth sealing if they come undone ok
The knock pins and rubbers on the f2 head are reduced to 4 on the outer studs but on the k models there are 8 the oil drains down the inner ones on the k model, you would be wise to study the parts you need for the f2 as they are different from the k, you have to have dome nuts and copper washers on the 4 studs that dont have the knock pins, and little rubber o rings at the base of the barrels on two of the studs these never come in gasket sets
pete
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So I will need to get the notch pins then + I need to get some o rings then
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F2
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/f2_zpsqwatfi7u.jpg) (http://s924.photobucket.com/user/UK-Pete/media/f2_zpsqwatfi7u.jpg.html)
F1 and some K models
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/f1%20head_zpsptrb92tp.jpg) (http://s924.photobucket.com/user/UK-Pete/media/f1%20head_zpsptrb92tp.jpg.html)
Definitely get a parts manual and check out f2 engine build threads on here and us site
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Cheers Pete can't say I'm looking forward to building this back up
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http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107040.0
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Found this it mentions that he didn't use the notch pins in it .
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Ordered missing parts I need & o rings .been cleaning gasket surfaces up and noticed one of the cylinder sleeves as a slight bit of damage on it .making it sit higher than the sealing surface .do I need to get it skimmed or would I be ok trying to sand it down ??[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Just carefully drawfile and wet n dry
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Just taken it back to machine shop .he's going to check with gauge if rest of its ok he say he will just file it up .
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Just been and seen Yozzers project in the flesh - its looking excellent!! and is a credit to your the detailing you have in your design
Keep up with the postings Yozzer - Spring will soon be here.
If you need a carb sync (if you don't have one) when your ready give me a mail and I pop it up
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Thanks good to meet you .probably take you up on offer of carb sync .Cheers
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Hi I've ordered all the missing parts that I need for my engine rebuild .been reading a lot of threads about rebuilds and how to prevent oil leaks .Thanks to byto and Pete on here .but one thing I'm not sure about is the four notch pins between the head & barrels .do I have to file them down because I've had the head skimmed .I've read people have had leaks .when they have had head and barrels skimmed .and not filed them down .Any ideas
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Assemble dry and check the "gap" with feelers the see how thick the gasket is, unless a lot was skimmed off you should be OK
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He did say he had skimmed a lot off it .I will do that thanks
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Yes as bryan says do it dry and measure, i would personally make them slightly undersize to avoid any problem
pete
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Will do .Just had my parts delivered from David silver's and there's one o ring missing not happy.
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Well I've checked the clearance and the gap was quite big so I've filed them down so there flush with the barrels .What is the purpose of these anyway.are they just to keep the rubber seals in place .if that's the case I'm sure it will be ok .being flush .
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Engineering dowells to position the head correctly on the barrels, likewise the barells to the crankcase has some more so the whole assembly aligns. The cam would also be parallel to the crank too. You may need to get some more if they don't locate the two components.
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The ones that position the head to the barrels are ok like wise the two that locate the barrels to the crank cases .these don't locate anything only the rubber seals as far as I can see
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I had to get out my manual to see what they do so sorry if my last post was a bit off and may have been talking at cross purposes with you.
Going from the outer most studs, the two front ones have the location dowells for head position, then the next pair of studs in clamping at back and front of Cylinders 1&4 have the sleeves you are talking about?
Honda manual describes these as "head gasket dowells" from which I get they are principally giving accurate location to get the fire rings centered over the bores, think there is more tolerance around other stuff like oil ways.
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I've been reading some were that Honda fitted these help with stop head gasket leaks .
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Interestingly as ukpete says somewhere else they deleted 4 of them on the F2 as compared to it's direct stablemate the K7 and all the previous Ks.
The oil running back down the studs is not really pressured, some people seem to have better succes at building them without leaks than others and you also get into the debate of using sealant or not and which type.
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Hi will this sealer be ok for for the rubber pucks .and another little set back .the main location notch pins I have for the head to barrels are the wrong size I've measured them at 19mm should be 18mm .they have seen better days too .
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
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Location pins sorted thanks r1pete for turning me them up on lathe .he also has a very nice E type jag worth the visit just to see that .
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Got some work done on engine today pistons back on rings fitted head & barrels on .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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A few pictures of some parts now there powder coated[attachimg=1]
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Looking good yozzer.
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(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/big-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/big-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/yes/big-thumbs-up-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/)
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Got engine finished today . Thanks everyone for advice on it .just need to get bottom end painted now . Glad I had fire made last summer . :)[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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Engine pictures[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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What's the deal with masking tape over clutch?
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Just seeing how easy it was to mask off when I spray it .
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Having moved battery under seat I need to get the starter motor cable to it .does anyone no if you can extend this cable .or would it have to be a new cable from starter motor .don't no if it's possible to change the wire completely.
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The cable is soldered inside the case of the starter motor. I extended mine by crimping it into a butt - end connector then soldering and shrink wrapping it.
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Does it work ok
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There's a lot of current going through that cable so any joining has got to be well made otherwise it will overheat.
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How many amps would it need to be .
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Does it work ok
Can't say as of yet, haven't had the chance to try it. I'm hoping to use the kickstart most of the time so should see minimal use.
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Was just going to put cam cover back o engine and noticed this .does anyone no if this should sit flush or should there be a gap [attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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There is normaly a small amount of end float
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Good so it should be ok then
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Made a engine stand so I could paint engine [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Engine painted need to find a finned points cover [attachimg=1][attach=2][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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That looks proper nice. I was going to do mine in Matt but seeing yours I'm having second thoughts.
What paint did you use.
Thanks. Steve.
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It's this got it off eBay [attachimg=1]
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That's the same paint I used on my 750F2 rebuild.
Went on well with a nice finish, I even baked it in the oven as per instructions.
The only problem I have found since is that every time I go out for a run with the engine fully hot it pings a bit more paint off the end of the fins. So far I have been re-blacking the missing bits with a permanent marker pen. I know its there but otherwise very hard to detect.
I don't think it was anything I did wrong as the head and barrels were bead blasted then degreased first, and I followed the instructions to the letter. Its not happened so far on the 350F with the silver aluminium finish paint, or the matt black I used on another bike. Just the gloss black.
Hope it doesn't happen for you. Sorry to sound negative, but its something to watch for.
Bikes looking superb by the way.
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Thanks for letting me no stranger how Matt doesn't chip off .
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Taken me a while to get through this thread, but have to say hat's off to you. Great quality work.
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Cheers mate
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I used the same paint in aluminium silver for my engine, and baked as per instructions. It looks the part, but the first real run of the engine will be tomorrow so the toughness of the paint still needs to be determined on mine.
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Well I was hoping to get engine back in frame this week but I've had problems with the paint on engine .I wasn't 100% happy with it first time .it keeps reacting I've done it 4 times now .still not perfect but I'm going to go with it .got to say it's tested my patience .better news I got a finned points cover of a forum member on sohc4 all the way from Australia it was a bit rough but I had it vapour blasted .then I polished it up came out ok .I also decided to get the stator cover and sprocket cover powder coated .because the paint kept reacting on them .so hopefully next week I can get engine back in .
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Pics[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]Couple of pics of engine one of them is were it's reacted the other one looks a good finish
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Thats a lovely full gloss black
pete
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Looking good to me.
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Right promise these are the last pictures of engine not perfect but it's as good as I'm going to get it [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Got engine back in frame today .was a lot easier laying engine on its side and dropping frame over it .than it was when I stripped it down .got oil tank fitted too .Going to pick some parts up tomorrow that I've had chromed.I've had them done in a brushed finish.[attachimg=2][attachimg=4][attachimg=3]
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Oil tank covered in rags for fitting stop it getting scratches on .
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Picked bits up from being chromed.glad these were the only bits I wanted doing bit expensive this chroming game .[attachimg=1]
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Excellent read on this project. Reminds me of my CB750F2 Special from a few years ago
(http://i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv23/WiNot_Rhencullen/Honda%20750/My750043.jpg)
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Nice yoshi .I see you did the break convertion to twin piston calipers are they off the 900f .does it make much difference to the breaks performance. Got some more work done on bike today swing arm on and shockers on forks rebuilt with new seals .and wheels on .Will put some pictures on tomorrow.also hoping to get pipe on tomorrow too.
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A few pictures of the work I did yesterday [attachimg=1[attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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Some more [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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And some more [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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The CB900FA twin piston calipers did make a big difference. I used Ferodo Supersport pads, as they are my preferance. One finger braking was possible ;)
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Bloody brilliant. Well done Yozzer and great to see all your hard work coming alive.....I remember the early photos of the fuel tank and oil tank/ toolbox cover but they look even better on the (nearly) finished bike.
I'm not a big fan of Cafe Racers but I have to admire yours as it's one of the best I have seen......and it hasn't been done by a specialist professional with many tens of thousands of pounds thrown at it, but by a skilled bloke in his Garage.
Well done.
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Thanks for that MCITD
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Nice one Yozzer that thing is spectacular. Cant wait to see the finished product. 8)
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Thanks for comments appreciate it
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Mmmmmm.... Shiny... 8)
Looking fantastic.
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Bloody amazing yozzer a really nice build
I have two cafe racers waiting to be done some of my parts are the same as yours like the adjustable clip ons
pete
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Thanks Pete .you will have to get cracking on the cafe builds .Well I got a little bit more done today .made some oil pipes up .and got the carbs out I've been dreading this part with all the bad things ive read about these carbs .does anyone no of any links were people have stripped the carbs totally down .separated the bank .think I'm going to have them vapour blasted first .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=2]
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Carbs[attachimg=2]
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Sanded Honda emblem down on calipers then polished them up .[attachimg=1]
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Think I've dropped a b####k having carbs vapour blasted they are now full of little glass beads .but they do look clean .there going to need a full strip down which is a job I didn't want to do
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Carbs [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4]
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There's a guy in Holland called Gerben Van Der Mere that does a cracking carb rebuild at reasonable cost. Those PD carbs are a sod to do. Surprised the vapour blaster didn't advise you to strip them first, as now all your springs and linkages will rust like crazy. I had mine done and they came out like new, 6 months later they look like they were never done. Back to the standard dull grey finish. I would post them off to Gerben.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
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Hey yozzer, think logically the F2 carbs are a pig, but when the bikes left the factory they were fit for purpose so , it should be achievable getting them correct, the fuel pump and its jets need the most attention, there are little one way valves that get stuck and the very fine jets that squirt the fuel get blocked real easy , you can take them out and put a fine wire brush hair to clear them, once you have built them fill them with fuel on the bench and make sure each jet is spraying, cause that causes the throttle delay, the rest is the same as any other carb, however when these carbs were new they were a pig at warm up simply cause they were made to run lean, you have to piss around with the chock for a while till it hot that is normal
pete
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Fitted my exhaust but when it's tightened up it touches the sump.any ideas how to solve problem I will get some pics on tomorrow of it .
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Some pictures of how close exhaust is think I'm going to after make a bracket to hold it off the engine .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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Crikey thats tight, could of done with another 10mm of clearance, pushing it down with a rear bracket might just do it, however you dont want to stress it too much incase it cracks over time
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Yeah that's a problem I've been in touch with carpy who I got it off .is answer to it was shave the fins off the sump .not good
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Thats not a bad idea, sumps are quite cheap, its the wrong answer from the seller though, he should check the rest of his stock before selling more, and possibly offer a bit of discount for your troubles
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He's ok at selling you things but not good on returning them .I bought some k&n filters off him when I got them he had sent the wrong size .he then told me he couldn't get the right size but he was still selling them on is web site .he did refund me in the end but he didn't refund the 25 pounds import tax .
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Well i dont think i will be buying anything from him then
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No me neither now .
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If its not touching it should be fine.
At least you won't have a ground clearance problem ;D
Mick
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Not posted for a while been waiting for my carbs to come back .he's sent me some pictures of them finished today so here they are [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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just nice!
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H,did you send the carbs to Gerben in Holland? thinking of having mine refurbed.
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http://m.harpers-ultrasonic.com/ I had them done here
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Carbs look nice, did they say if the paint is fuel proof
pete
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Yeah it's armoured coating weapons graded paint .so should be ok .time will tell .
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Think it's called gunkote paint .
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Got carbs fitted today [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Does anyone no if the throttle cable's on the f2 are different to f1 .my bike had f1 carbs on when I got it .was going to keep the cables but they don't seem to fit .
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F1 uses the previous type carbs as far as I know and likely common to the K6 in design, F2 is PD type carbs and will need specific cables which I think are common to that and K7.
That motor looks really nice, very good looking work on the whole bike.
Gunkote I think is from a company called Kalgard which specialised in US military equipment protective coatings, I know they did some pretty impressively specified coatings and also made one of the best chainlubes I've ever come across "Chainkote" be interesting to see how the carb's finish works out.
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Well the guy who did them did is first set 3years ago and says they still look the same as when he did them .I've found out the f2 cables are longer got some on way.thanks for comment on bike
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I'm liking the velocity stacks, how's the fuelling with them fitted, do they have an internal gauze?
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Don't no about fuelling yet .but they do have gauze inside them .
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Cheers, I might go for a set of those .
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I got them from dime city cycles in US
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Cheers, actually I'm just trying something this afternoon , fitting velocity stacks inside my pod filters (home made) just to see what happens (if anything), but I'll no doubt move to just stacks for appearance sake eventually .
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Started making my wiring harness .with the help of Bryan drawing a diagram for me. [attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Need a little help with my wiring got all lights working starter motor turns engine over but I have no spark wired yellow& blue wires from points to coils then black&white to switch .but there's no spark any ideas what to look for .Cheers
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You should have a constant 12v supply to the coils with ignition switched on and the coils earthed through the points only when they are closed.
When you rotate the crank, the wires through the points should lose continuity to earth as the points open. If not, then you'd suspect the insulator washers where the wires and condensers connect to the points as if they are assembled wrongly the wire tracks to earth before it even gets to the contact face to be switched by the points.
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I'm getting 12 volts to coils when ignition is on and I haven't touched the points as the bike was running before I stripped it .Will check tomorrow
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Easy way to check the points is disconnect the blue\yellow wires and open the points then put a piece of card in the gap, then continuity check down each wire to the points across to earth and you should have no continuity. Pull the card out and continuity should be there with the points closed.
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Thanks I will give it a try
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I've disconnected the blue and yellow wire from the points put card in between points now how do I test for continuity
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Have you got a volt meter that beeps when you connect the two probes together?
I so you put one probe onto one of the wires to the points and the other on onto the points mounting plate and you should have no connection\beep.
The status you are looking for with the card in place is for no electrical connect through the points to earth, if it tracks through then you are looking at a fault somewhere in that system you've checked.
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Yeah I have one I will go out and give it a try cheers
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Ok so I've done that test I don't get a beep at all with card in or out when I touch the back plate only time I get a beep is when I touch number 2&3 points
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If I lift the points with a screw driver I get a spark across the points which give me a week spark at plugs .?? Anyone no what's wrong
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Check the voltage at the points leads when the points are open to see if there is a voltage drop on any connections
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Ok just checked I've got12.8volts going in to coils and coming out and same down at points
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Just tryed kicking it with kick start producing a little spark at points then tried starter button now a big spark across 1&4 points and plugs sparking on 1&4 but nothing on 2&3 ??
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When you lift the points with it all connected yes it should spark.
What the points are doing is controlling the earth connection for the coils, when points open earth is removed and ht part of coil finds earth via the plugs so making a spark.
It's abit back to front as you are sending a current to the plugs by breaking the coil primary circuit so slightly counter intuitive to a conventional circuit if that makes sense.
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The points shouldn't spark much, so how old are the condensors? The idea of the condenser is to reduce sparking at the points and reduce pitting of the points
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They were on bike when I got it but I do have receipt when po bought them .it had a new back plate on do you think it would be worth buying new points & condensers
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Have a look at the points under a magnifying glass, the bits that contact each other, if badly pitted then replace them, if not too bad, you can dress them with a piece of wet and dry folded over and pulled through a few times. Out of curiosity were they genuine points and condensors? As the late Bitsa would always rant, buy pattern parts at your own peril, they tend to be crap! It really can make a big difference using genuine parts on the ignition system.
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The receipt is from David silver's the po bought a back plate with points on so I think there pattern parts
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Is it worth going to electronic ignition
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Very much a matter o personal preference, personally I wouldn't, but there are many on here who have, and are happy with the result.
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Well I tried coils off a Gs550 I have .on my bike and I get a spark now on all four cylinders ;D
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Is it worth going to electronic ignition
Definitely, I got mine for Dave Silvers, easy fit starts first push every time [i don't use the kicker, too old for that malarkey]
PS... sent you personal message
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Quick question does anyone no how much oil the cb750 holds and what oil do you recommend .think I'm going to after use a little more than standard with size of oil tank
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can't remember quantity but any 10w40 oil of the right spec but not synthetic. Tesco own brand mineral diesel oil is correct spec
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Honda manual for F2 750 says capacity is 3.5 litres.
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Cheers just trying to get oil pressure nothing happens could pump have a air lock in it .
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Honda manual says with pump removed, immerse into oil and rotate drive wheel anti clockwise until oil comes with out of the two feeds to prime it.
Then install in sump prior to turning engine.
Just a quick thought, are you confident of the feed line from your oil tank going to the right port on engine as it looks non standard?
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Yeah she's running now got good oil pressure going to try put a video on now
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Always nice when you get something running, and closer to getting out on the road as well.
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https://youtu.be/M9ci9negqm8
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Well happy how she started up great to here her running she's very loud .
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Hey yozzer, i absolutely love the look of your cafe racer, well done and its sounds good as well, loud and proud is the way tgo go fella
pete
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Cheers Pete can't believe how well it started and it's defo loud
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Superb Yozzer, great bit of work.
PS I've only scan read this but it appears to say it doesn't matter how loud our bikes are
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200304/ldlwa/40525wa1.pdf
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MOT book sez it has to be as quiet as a standrd bike
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It's not going to pass mot then lol
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its the mot testers discretion
pete
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I no someone who will pass it ;D
There good like that
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MOT book sez it has to be as quiet as a standrd bike
Strangely enough, the younger the tester, the less of a problem it is. The place I take my bikes to admits he has absolutely no idea how loud the original pipes on a bike would have been, he wasn't born till 1986, and has never seen an old Honda with stock pipes, so has no comparison! So, provided the exhaust isn't falling apart, and has some form of visible baffling, it's okay by him.
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OK just about got my wiring harness finished now .just got to shrink wrap it up .I've had problems getting indicators to flash .I'm on to my fourth relay now .they are now flashing but slowly .if I fitted resistors would they flash faster .they are led indicators.
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Well I'm still working through making wiring harness .can't believe how long it's taking .got my new coils fitted and clocks on today .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
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Made a little video of the build so far thought I would share it https://youtu.be/9bhiINRTh6Q
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Great vid, you have built yourself a stunning cafe there fella , fricking awesome , well done
pete
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Superb!
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+1 with Pete great bike.
Will the rectifier stay cool enough there?
Mick
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Thanks .time will tell with rectifier but I am thinking the same
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On the Guzzi V7 they mount it right at the front of the bike so its cooled by the wind.It makes sence but not really a fan as I think it looks a little out of place.
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Yeah that's why I mounted it were it is but after having bike running it does feel hot in that area but I'm hoping when it's moving it gets some air flow past it
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Mines mounted under the seat exposed to the rear wheel, not had a problem yet, watched the vid twice, missed where yours is both times!, where is it?
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Mark you can see it in the first pic mounted behind the coils
I was just woundering if it would stay cool there as the on on my old S4 it was mounted on the side of the bike behind the side panel and would get crazy hot due to the lack of air flow
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Just stunning.
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SMALL UPDATE .THE BOLTS THAT HOLD CALIPERS ON WERE IN BAD SHAPE. I WANTED THE NEW ONES TO MATCH THE TITANIUM RACE BOLTS THAT IVE FITTED BUT ONE OF THEM WAS A SPECAIL PIN BOLT .SO I HAD ONE OFF WELDING & ENGINEERING MAKE ME SOME UP .I BOUGHT SOME LAGER BOLTS AND PAUL TURNED THEM UP ON LATHE ..[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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Bloody hell yozzer when will it stop!!!
Looks the nuts though, wish I was a bit closer to one off, probably a good job I'd end up divorced.
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just a small up date had a bracket made to hold the clocks on the yokes a little lower down .they were sitting too high before .it also fits the oil light in it .also got a taco plug to match my tappit covers ...[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5]
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just had bike accepted into the revival bike show .best pull my finger out and get her finished.
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Nice one yozzer. The hard work has paid off.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Cheers mate
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This is the show if anyone is interested it's in rotherham on the 29 th 30 th of October .[attachimg=1]
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A FEW PICS OF BIKE NOW SHES NEARLY DONE .[
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.[attachimg=3]
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.[attachimg=1]
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Looking good dude. I might see about getting up there, For the 29th. See how the finances are.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Had a number board put on bike today breaks all that alloy up a little .[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
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Looks well, any relevance to the number?, bhp?, house number?, age? 😄
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It was a good year I was born lol
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Cafe Racers aren't really my thing, but I have to hand it to you that yours is a real beauty and a credit to you. I would be proud to own it and be seen on it.
Well done mate.
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The black carbs look interesting. Are they a set off Carb Keith in the USA?
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No had them done here at Harper's ultrasonic.
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That's a great move with the number dude. Looks ace.
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FEW MORE BITS DONE TANK DONE TO MATCH SEAT ALSO HAD SOME NUMBER PLATE BRACKETS MADE UP .I WAS GOING TO HAVE PLATE AT SIDE OF BIKE BUT CAME UP WITH THIS IDEA TURNED OUT GOOD I THINK BRAKETS MILLED OUT OF BILLET .ALSO GOT GEAR SELECTER MADE UP AND BRACKET FOR INGNITION .[attach=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=1][attachimg=3]
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Tank [attachimg=1]
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QUick test ride on bike today felt pretty good for first ride .https://youtu.be/zbgcRNNmLXc
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Sounds good, any shakedown issues?
PS here's my sound check video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4UE2he1Jhs&sns=em
Sent from my iPhone
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No issue's as such yet didn't really give her much .but when I went in garage day after .I could smell petrol .I had left petrol tap on I thought it had leaked out of over flow .but no it's leaked out of number 3 float bowl gasket leaking .it's made paint on engine peel .so looks like carbs are coming back off next chance I get
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Good news then, bound to be a few little niggles, the brake calliper stopped leaking?.
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Yeah they haven't leaked again ?? I'm hoping to get for mot this week if weather is OK
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Same with mine, maybe residual build oil or the seals need to bed in slightly, who knows!, MOT should be fine if your MOT tester is a sensible as mine, all he wanted to know was that the brakes worked!, good luck anyway.
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That really does look and sound good. That's a proper job.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Well removed carbs today one of bowels was leaking .the gaskets are new but there a little big compared to the ones that came off so I thought I would try a old one on them .so far no leak fingers crossed .also fitted new ignition bracket I had made .
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Ignition [attachimg=1]
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Very nicely built, a credit to you. :)
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Took bike for mot today she passed very happy. when I'm riding I can here the tappits .is this normal I've removed tap covers and there is oil there but not loads .am I just being paranoid .or should I be worried .
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Are you sure it's tappets you can hear, or pinking? Pinking sounds like lots of very expensive little twigs snapping, caused by weak fuel mixture, ign timing over advanced, or low quality fuel. If it is pinking, it needs sorting asap, as it can burn valves or even damage pistons.
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Not sure just thought it was tappits I will take another look
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Tacka tacka sound is tappets, clattery rustling sound is cam chain, carbs out of ballance make it worse, not forgetting there is clutch rattle to add to the mix, they are never going to be as mechanically quiet as modern engines, so bear in mind that if you are used to riding a more modern machine the honda might sound a bit agricultural, every time I go out on mine I become convinced that it's about to explode half way around the ride, then I get back to my driveway and it's humming away merrily on tickover, so I guess all is well, I've heard quite a few CB750's that are mechanically noisy but also one that a quiet as a mouse, Bytio's Phil read replica, he had completely rebuilt the engine and obviously made a very good job of it (or were his tappets clearances too small! 😧) my advice is check the fuelling is ok (plug colour) if it is just ride and enjoy it , earplugs help 😄
PS I've heard people say that oil splashes about if you remove a tappet cap with the engine running, mine never has, the components are all wet with oil but it's not like the North Sea in there!, anyway I've done over 2k miles and the top end seems fine).
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Cheers I'm probably just being paranoid .has its first engine I've built like you say oil isn't splashing around but they are covered in oil
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Wow, this looks amazing. Another one i've missed keeping up on.
A real credit to you, great work. Really looking forward to seeing it in the flesh.
And I agree, 74 was a proper good year. ;D
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Truly inspiring stuff here!
I love the tank especially. Can I ask where you had this made?
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One off welding& engineering
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Got a few miles in on bike today she is still smoking .but does ride well .I've had plugs out and there black .& the bike starts up without the choke .does this mean it's running rich .what do I need to do to sort it out .the smoke is sometimes black too thanks in advance for any help
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Try dropping your needles 1 notch and see how it is, also before doing that, triple check your float levels.
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Can you do that on f2 with the needles
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No you cant drop the needles into existing differing positions on an f2 cause they havent got any, but you can shim the needle,I think theres a kit available.
Cheers
Mike
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Some further thoughts on the Jetting.
Assuming you've got the accelerator pump working ok? Do you know which size main jet they are running? And which air filters have you used? Also are you using the original bellmouths inside the filters?
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I put 140 mains in and I'm running velocity stacks pump is working cheers
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Here's what I believe is happening, if I post it we should get some input as to how you can optimise it.
When you start with the original intake system it has a manufacturer set draw / restriction on which the carbs operate. If you open the throttle slides fully, then with the engine flat out, the draw through the main jets is controlled by that fixed process, so the original jet size is set to supply demand under those conditions. They then use the shape of the throttle slide in combination with the needle taper to get a linear delivery of fuelling as you move away from wide open throttle all the way down until you get to the idle circuit.
This relationship is vital to jetting and throttle response being accurate throughout the engine's range. It's important to note that as the throttle slides get more closed, then the vacuum characteristics are progressively handed over from the airbox intake design to the throttle slide design as you move away from absolute maximum flow. It's this area I believe that's most changed by removing the original intake.
When you remove the original airbox, you remove a restriction which causes the carb when wide open to exercise less vacuum on the mainjet resulting in less fuel (running lean)being pulled from it. It's this effect that you're responding to when upping the main jet size just to get back to the same mixture for the engine, you are not running the engine at a different mixture from standard at wide open throttle. It's this point that people commonly don't consider.
So you've got the maximum throttle mixture something like correct by using bigger main jets. Now this is where it gets more interesting. Dropping away from wide open, you get much more into how the vacuum through the carb was controlled just by the throttle slide shape, which hasn't really changed. So you've now got very similar vacuum throughout made range but pulling fuel through a too large main jet. Unsurprisingly it runs rich.
If the original development engineers where doing this for that maximum flow they'd have had a number of different throttle slide shapes (different cut aways cause different vacuum gradient) along with a variety of differing needle shape to bring the Jetting and response into acceptable range. Without those options I doubt anyone would get close to optimum jetting over the whole range.
I'd start by just considering dropping main jet size and being careful to see how close you can get the wide open setting to optimum without running too lean at that point. This will get you closer too being right in made range.
You've got an additionally problem with accelerator pumps as well, as they're adding just where you've got it richest (they do nothing when the throttle and engine are at a constant flat out state). You may be needing snookers to truly get it right. It's also very difficult without previous experience or something like a dyno and exhaust gas analysis.
I'd start by trying something like a 120 main jet to give you a little better look at what it's doing.
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Wow thanks for all that information k2. I will give it a try .
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Watching this with baited breath. When I rebuilt my carbs I used 120 jets because of the pods.
I saw somewhere about restricting the flow using an old tshirt.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Hi Yozzer
I have not been on here for many months, just watched your you tube stuff on the F2 it looks and sounds the bowl lox! Hope you get the carbs sorted out soon...
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Got some miles in on bike last few weeks glad to report she's running great . Did 90 miles on her yesterday up to the yondermans cafe in Peak District . Nice ride enjoyed it . But she takes some cleaning afterwards
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Looks good, bet you are very pleased.
Where is the yondermans cafe in Peak district - thought I knew the area well???
Tim
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Map of we're it is I have no idea just followed my mate lol [attachimg=2][attachimg=1]
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Oh yes!
drive past that regularly. Always looks a bit rundown with old garage / petrol station in front. Is it a truckers cafe with big mugs of tea etc!
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There was a few bikes in there pics of bikes on walls . So it is set up for bikers .
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It does look a bit industrial .
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Glad to hear it's running well Yozzer 👍
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Bikes looking great yozzer - glad its now running as well as it looks
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Had bike in a show this weekend nice pic of her [attachimg=1]
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Was this at Motorcycle social Leeds?
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Lovely bike, the black Comstars and tailpiece really set it off. Nice to see a yard build without the normal spoke wheels and fat Firestones for a change.
Do you have any video's of it running?
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It was motorcycle social in Leeds.
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https://youtu.be/zbgcRNNmLXc https://youtu.be/zbgcRNNmLXc video of bike running laverda 120
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Video from the show https://youtu.be/pQhV11ycbIg
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Tank leak sorted then..... looks supurb.
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Yeah all sorted now he welded a new neck in for monza cap .fingers crossed it will be ok now