Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 07:39:49 AM

Title: Video rebuild
Post by: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 07:39:49 AM: As I never did an apprenticeship or worked in the trade I sometimes found the Haynes manual assumes more knowledge than I possess. Julie’s rebuild has been a wonderful boost and various post have helped however when I was faced with a bench full of clean bits I was definitely nervous about getting it right. Whilst reading the manual again and pondering how to start my son asked me when I would get on with it. So explained my fears, “oh” he says, fingers tapping on his smart phone, there is a you tube video if it’s any good.

This is it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vR-MiqdHi1w (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vR-MiqdHi1w)

Now I’m sure it’s not perfect but it really helped. So I was wondering, we have a wealth of knowledge on this forum and a lot of people who would like to know how. Would it be possible for a series of SOHC “approved “ on how to xyz be done. It would be a shame to lose the knowledge.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: SteveD CB500K0 on March 25, 2019, 09:09:57 AM: Interesting.

I'd be happy to put links in Aladdin's Cave (as long as Julie says these vids are OK :))
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Nurse Julie on March 25, 2019, 09:38:13 AM: I think it's a great idea. The problem is that everyone builds engines slightly differently and uses different processes and methods and who is to say what is correct or incorrect. I think if we are going to have them in Aladins Cave, it should be pointed out that the person recommending the video has his / her name put to it saying they found it useful as a resource.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Trigger on March 25, 2019, 10:33:19 AM: Those vids have been kicking about for a couple of years and contains quite a few NO, NO's if building a engine ;)
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: hairygit on March 25, 2019, 10:50:54 AM: Why not let Julie video YOU doing some rebuilds then Trig, that way people can be sure it's the right way to do it!
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 10:57:44 AM: Part of the reason to raise this is to find out what are the OMG don’t do that. I think one is to not put oil behind the bearing shells, but correct me if I’m wrong.

Greg
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Nurse Julie on March 25, 2019, 11:24:21 AM: Quote from: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 10:57:44 AM
Part of the reason to raise this is to find out what are the OMG don’t do that. I think one is to not put oil behind the bearing shells, but correct me if I’m wrong.

Greg
You are correct Greg. Oil under the bearing shells is definitely wrong. You knew that and I'm sure you didn't do it but, if someone watches that Vid and does as that builder did, it could end in tears. I think this is what causes me most concern, that chap obviously thinks its the thing to do but, its not, so are the rest of the people using this vid as a guide doing the same?
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Rozabikes Tim on March 25, 2019, 11:55:34 AM: I looked at that some months ago and although a good guide, even with my limited knowledge, things were wrong or missing. I referred to the clutch nut removal from that vid in another post. Felt he was feeling his way, as at the beginning he said it was the first Jap motor he had worked on. However credit to him for taking the time to do it.

Sure with the skills on this site we could do much better :D
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: hondarc166 on March 25, 2019, 06:30:17 PM: do you think it's wrong to put oil on the outside of the ball bearings why not oil the balls ? also I think there was to much blue sealant on the cases looking how much squeezed out it might go inwards to
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 06:40:50 PM: Now I’m sure I will be corrected if wrong but can see no problem with oil on ball bearings. I agree that the blue was excessive. I believe from the senior ward sister a smear (not a test) is all that is required. Standby for corrections.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Bryanj on March 25, 2019, 06:53:51 PM: Oil in the brgs yes on the brgs no and if any compounds squidges its too much.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Nurse Julie on March 25, 2019, 08:05:52 PM: Quote from: Greg65 on March 25, 2019, 06:40:50 PM
Now I’m sure I will be corrected if wrong but can see no problem with oil on ball bearings. I agree that the blue was excessive. I believe from the senior ward sister a smear (not a test) is all that is required. Standby for corrections.
Corrections.....NO, I repeat NO Hylomar of any colour anywhere near an engine. What I said use a smear of would have been Hondabond on bare machined surfaces only, ie, joining top and bottom crank cases where no gasket is used. Hylomar, or similar, can be the death of an engine when it squidges inside and goes all stringy and blocks oilways and jets. Gaskets do not need Hylomar, the gasket makes the seal.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: royhall on March 26, 2019, 06:59:59 AM: If you use Hylomar it should be put onto the gasket in a very thin layer and allowed to dry before fitting. As per the instructions on the box. I used it on the clutch and alternator covers due to the surface being scored by a previous owner (possibly bad storage of the spare cases at some point). If used correctly it's not an issue. Problems arise when it's spread like toothpaste. As stated if it gets inside the engine it will trash it. I don't use it if all the surfaces are okay as the gasket will be good enough.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: SteveD CB500K0 on March 26, 2019, 07:19:56 AM: So that’s a no then.

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Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Trigger on March 26, 2019, 07:53:44 AM: Crank case main bolts, hand tightened too much, then put a torque wrench on and the torque wrench doesn't even move, and then hand tighten again :o

Had this engine arrive a couple of days ago, had a shed load of new parts fitted but, the oil filter spring on the outside rang bells straight away and you just know that there is trouble ahead ???

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Bryanj on March 26, 2019, 09:05:58 AM: I think you ought to video the stripdown of that one Trigger!
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Trigger on March 26, 2019, 09:15:50 AM: Quote from: Bryanj on March 26, 2019, 09:05:58 AM
I think you ought to video the stripdown of that one Trigger!

Already stripped mate.

Seem to have a few bits missing from the kick shaft mechanism and new crank shells have been put in but the crank centre journal is chewed. What a waste of shells but, it keeps Sliver in business :o

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: royhall on March 26, 2019, 09:44:19 AM: You should start a black museum of pictures Trig.

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Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: paul G on March 26, 2019, 10:13:35 AM: Quote from: Trigger on March 26, 2019, 09:15:50 AM
Quote from: Bryanj on March 26, 2019, 09:05:58 AM
I think you ought to video the stripdown of that one Trigger!

Already stripped mate.

Seem to have a few bits missing from the kick shaft mechanism and new crank shells have been put in but the crank centre journal is chewed. What a waste of shells but, it keeps Sliver in business :o
And you busy ;) ;D ;D

(Attachment Link)
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: mike the bike on March 26, 2019, 10:50:38 AM: I once made the mistake of using Loctite bearing fit under the shells. The crank would hardly turn so I has to strip it down again and clean the shite off.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: royhall on March 26, 2019, 04:27:15 PM: Wow. Just watched both videos, I think he will be seeing the insides of that engine again fairly soon. Not sure he understands the concepts of what it is he is meant to be doing. That's a sure way to get your bearings spinning in the cases if ever I saw one. Hylomar is not meant to be used in that manner, that's either RTV or Hondabond, as Julie pointed out it's going to end up everywhere. And I couldn't wait for the bit Trigger pointed out, over tighten the bolts first then check you have overdone it with the torque wrench, then just to be sure go for it again. What happened to half torque then three quarters etc going round the sequence until fully tight. Funniest thing I have seen in a while. At least he tried. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Sprocket on March 26, 2019, 05:01:29 PM: This thread needs more popcorn! ;D

I've seen all the vids before but I'm really really interested in some concepts you guys are discussing here as I'm about to rebuilt my engine. I've referred to his vids and the Haynes book to disassemble so far and touch wood I've not had any major problems. I'm intending on taking as long as it needs to reassemble but knowing things like 'don't oil the back of the shells', 'use Hondabond not Hylomar' and so on are really useful tidbits.

At the risk of exposing some massive industry secrets, Trigger, Julie and all, could you give me a rundown on some good practise and common pitfalls?
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: royhall on March 26, 2019, 05:10:04 PM: Biggest one is to ensure everything is totally clean before you start and that is especially so when it comes to the oil galleries. If the cases have been blasted (except for soda blasting) ensure that no blast media whatsoever remains on or in the casings. And don't blast the casing insides. Soda blast them if your really not sure you can get the grit out. Any blast grit remaining in the casings will rapidly destroy your new engine.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Rob62 on March 26, 2019, 07:25:07 PM: It would be useful for members to have access to correct information, especially for precise operations like engine rebuilding. On the honda NSR forum, for example, is a very detailed build sequence for the engine (not a video but a very detailed sequence)... so that members don’t have to look on youtube and fall victim to rogue diy technicians....
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: daz-j on March 26, 2019, 08:09:44 PM: Hi all, the discussion seems to support Greg65's original point. I was previously a member on a BMW E30zone car forum which had a 'Wiki' section – articles written and verified by the more knowledgeable members that documented an agreed way of doing particular tasks. As a beginner I would welcome such a section on here. I guess maybe that was the intention of the Aladdin's Cave? The E30zone Wiki had 100's of articles and I think many were written by taking the important points from previous threads on a particular subject. It was also the 1st place to look before posting a question and so saved a lot of repetition.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Andych on March 26, 2019, 09:23:33 PM: Personally I think Julies build thread is as good a reference as you would want... lots of pictures and good, accurate descriptions.. when I finally get to mine that will be my reference tool.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Man Of Kent on October 20, 2019, 04:08:13 PM: I am so glad that I have read this thread first. I have been watching this chaps video a few times to learn about stripping and building a 400/4 engine. I have never built an engine in my life as I am a joinery manufacturer but I want to learn as I have many projects here to play with. I am just in the process in building a new shed in the back garden to have as a man cave and to play with my bikes in the evening instead of sitting indoors watching the boss of the house soaps.
In the New Year I was going to strip and build the 400 but I would love to see a video showing me how to do it correctly, if I hadn't seen this thread I would have defiantly put oil under the shells and probably made a mistake on the torque settings.
I am a complete novice so am I expecting too much of myself or should I do an SS50 engine first as I have got five of them here. Lol
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: Nurse Julie on October 20, 2019, 06:08:19 PM: You will be just fine.....take your time and keep asking questions on here.
Title: Re: Video rebuild
Post by: taysidedragon on October 20, 2019, 07:25:53 PM: I recommend that you do a rebuild on a single cylinder engine first if you've never done it before. That'll be a lot simpler to learn the principles on. On the 400 you've 4 cylinders to do and a lot more components to play with.
Since you have SS50 engines already, learn on one of them before jumping in the deep end. 👍