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SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: DaveN on December 03, 2020, 06:08:33 PM

Title: MoT or Not?
Post by: DaveN on December 03, 2020, 06:08:33 PM
Hi Folks, just a quick straw-poll.

How many of you put their classic bikes through an MoT even if they are MoT Exempt?

Just curious :-)
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on December 03, 2020, 06:11:48 PM
I plan to when I get to that stage. Wonder if it might lower insurance premium?
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Nurse Julie on December 03, 2020, 06:19:57 PM
Yep, I have all my Historic bikes MOT'd each year.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Nurse Julie on December 03, 2020, 06:21:43 PM
I plan to when I get to that stage. Wonder if it might lower insurance premium?
No, it doesn't lower the premiums Ted. Insurance companies have absolutely no interest whatsoever if its MOT'd or not but they are very, very interested in knowing we keep it roadworthy at all times.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: MrDavo on December 03, 2020, 06:30:18 PM
No, though when I do need an MOT I've been using the same place for 30 years. They trust me to put a bike together properly, I don't recall ever failing one. They have pointed out the odd loose spoke, it shows they do it thoroughly. We have an 'understanding' about my Sportster, which is that it obviously came in for the MOT with the original legal silencers (they live in a box in the garage, and are so heavy and restrictive the bike doesn't pull top gear with them on), and if I ever get pulled I put the loud pipes on since the MOT. ;) Touch wood, I never get pulled on the Harley for noise, as a copper once said to me, 'they all sound like that'.

If there's anything wrong with one of my exempt bikes, trust me, I already know about it.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Nurse Julie on December 03, 2020, 06:47:11 PM
Trigger gets totally pissed off that I take mine for MOT's. He is the one that builds the bikes for me and maintains all of them and I do trust him 100% that everything is perfect but I just like a piece of paper for the bikes history files 😁😁😁. I even have one of his historic bikes MOT'd, just because I ride it. Never had a MOT failure on a bike yet.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Moorey on December 03, 2020, 07:33:16 PM

 I no longer take the historic's for MOT.  :)
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: cooleronthecoast on December 03, 2020, 08:01:23 PM
It might sound arrogant but I won't MOT a Historic that I've prepared myself. 
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Bryanj on December 03, 2020, 08:36:28 PM
As a long time MOT tester i would still take a fresh build for mot as a second pair of eyes may find something i inadvertantly missed
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: SteveW on December 03, 2020, 08:49:11 PM
I have not had an MOT on my 550 since Feb 18, I keep it in tip top condition.

When they introduced the MOT exemption, it crossed my mind that what happens in an accident?

Suppose you have an accident and your insurance company asks the questions, was your bike roadworthy at the time of the accident and if so can you prove it?

We all know the lengths insurance companies will go to to avoid paying out.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Johnny4428 on December 03, 2020, 09:19:07 PM
Probably a good idea to take a totally rebuilt bike for mot initially when recommissioning. Bikes I have rebuilt in the past I have been confident to take them out with no mot, but there’s a big difference between confidence and qualified as far as roadworthy goes. Good point raised in the interest of safety.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: taysidedragon on December 04, 2020, 12:21:36 AM
I have not had an MOT on my 550 since Feb 18, I keep it in tip top condition.

When they introduced the MOT exemption, it crossed my mind that what happens in an accident?

Suppose you have an accident and your insurance company asks the questions, was your bike roadworthy at the time of the accident and if so can you prove it?

We all know the lengths insurance companies will go to to avoid paying out.
I know what you mean about insurance companies but having an MOT certificate is no proof that the bike is roadworthy up to 12 months later.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on December 04, 2020, 12:31:48 AM
I take our SL 500 to the MB main dealer in Derby since I worked for them as a driver between 2004 to current date as I get a friends & family discount. I worked for Inchcape until 2018. Earlier this year they failed it's MoT on the number plate spacing despite it having had the same plates fitted since 2003 - they were arguably misspaced by 5 mm even though they were BS stamped.

I declined the free Inchcape Logo'd plastic number plates they offered - I returned for a free re-test with a nice set of pressed alloy plates to collect a Pass a couple of days later. Apparently they were under scrutiny by VOSA/DVSA due to a dodgy sacked employee.

I will take my 400/4 for a test to confirm if you will the work I will have done. After that I probably will not bother.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: AshimotoK0 on December 04, 2020, 07:08:27 AM

I declined the free Inchcape Logo'd plastic number plates they offered - I returned for a free re-test with a nice set of pressed alloy plates to collect a Pass a couple of days later. Apparently they were under scrutiny by VOSA/DVSA due to a dodgy sacked employee.


About 5 years ago I took a trusty 20 year old Toyota into the MOT garage near where I work. Went back at 5pm to pick it up and the owner said ..it passed TWICE and all it needed was a wiper blade. After he had MOT'd it, 1st thing  in the morning and passsed  it, two guys came in, one with a clipboard the other in his overalls. They were from VOSA and had been monitoring my MOT on a laptop in the car park next door. They didn't believe a 20 year old car sailed though it's MOT and spent one and a half hours with it in the MOT bay inspecting it. Subsequently told the garage owner 'well done' and then b*ggered off.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: paul G on December 04, 2020, 07:45:02 AM
I have taken all mine once after their full restorations just to prove at the time they were road worthy.
I don't plan to take them now they have reached the historic classification.
As previous posts they are meticulously maintained and never had one fail  ;D 
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: TrickyMicky on December 04, 2020, 08:13:56 AM
A MOT certificate only states that it was roadworthy when presented for test.  If you are unfortunate enough to have an incident and the police/VOSA state that your vehicle is unroadworthy, THAT is what an insurance company will take note of. You can present them with a current valid MOT ticket and it won't make one iota of difference. I would like to think that judging by the amount of correspondence on this and other historic vehicle forums, there's an incredible amount of knowledge, skill, and care in the upkeep of these vehicles.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: paul G on December 04, 2020, 09:51:45 AM
A MOT certificate only states that it was roadworthy when presented for test.  If you are unfortunate enough to have an incident and the police/VOSA state that your vehicle is unroadworthy, THAT is what an insurance company will take note of. You can present them with a current valid MOT ticket and it won't make one iota of difference. I would like to think that judging by the amount of correspondence on this and other historic vehicle forums, there's an incredible amount of knowledge, skill, and care in the upkeep of these vehicles.
Fully understand that but it proves it was rebuilt to an MOT standard at that point and not a dogs dinner  ;D
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Moorey on December 04, 2020, 12:56:46 PM

 It would be for the insurance company to prove it was unroadworthy
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: philward on December 04, 2020, 02:31:04 PM
I'm with previous posts - initial MOT after rebuild and then don't bother
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: mike the bike on December 04, 2020, 11:00:47 PM
With 2 cars, my GPZ and my lad's Lexmoto all needing an MOT, it's good to have one that don't need one.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Athame57 on December 04, 2020, 11:15:19 PM
I always saw an MOT test as a means of getting wrecks of the road or forcing maintenance! 
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Seamus on December 05, 2020, 08:29:41 AM
Interesting views, I have tested many classic cars and bikes over the years. Most are fine and the owners only have them tested to have a piece of paper saying they are roadworthy.
Just peace of mine in case somethimng happens.
One classic car specialist that I know has been asked countless times if he could do some sort of road worthyness examination of these vehicles and produce something to say that the vehicle in question was ok. His comment was that a mot would be much cheaper and its an official document.
Again I have had a few cases of careful owners with lots of experience fail on something that they have missed.
Personally, I have my 3 bikes and the car tested annually as do my friends with classic bikes or cars.

I have seen some pretty bad examples of classics, look great untill you start to look closely.

At the end of the day, its your call, but have you missed something?? :-\ ??? ::) ;D
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: sprinta on December 05, 2020, 03:48:24 PM
I have not had an MOT on my 550 since Feb 18, I keep it in tip top condition.

When they introduced the MOT exemption, it crossed my mind that what happens in an accident?

Suppose you have an accident and your insurance company asks the questions, was your bike roadworthy at the time of the accident and if so can you prove it?

We all know the lengths insurance companies will go to to avoid paying out.

An MOT is only valid as proof of being roadworthy on the day of issue. At any other time it remains your responsibility, so having a MOT for any other time except for the day of issue would not be proof that the bike was roadworthy at the time of an accident.   
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Bryanj on December 05, 2020, 05:07:11 PM
MOT is only valid at the time of test, not even on the drive home but testing station would get grilled if anything happened.
I once had an AJS for test last thing before lunch and a Matchless first thing after, caught them swapping front wheels in the road when i went for lunch----nothing i could legally do about it but made a note in the testers book
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Nurse Julie on December 05, 2020, 05:23:52 PM
I think the older we get, the easier it is to forget or overlook something. Another pair of eyes can see things we don't even remember to look at. To be honest, I think everyone on this forum maintains their bikes to such a high standard, the bike would pass any inspection at any time, just like it's meant to.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Green1 on December 05, 2020, 09:57:16 PM
I will carry on with out an MOT on my classics.
Its not hard to check things over on the bench once a year.
A classic car I think I would have checked as its harder to get underneath to check things over.

I took my Aprilia for its test last year and he picked up on a small amount of play in the rear shock linkage.
I have striped the rear end recently and found no play in the back end at all.New bearings seals and shock has now gone in with half a tin of fresh grease in everything so if it gets picked up again there is something fishy going on.

I checked my Transit tipper over just before its test recently everything was working great as the tester drove it up the ramp all the rear lights went out on one side. A quik wiggle of the loom all was back before the ramp had finished rising.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Lobo on December 06, 2020, 06:41:34 AM
Not relevant to this UK forum, though interesting is that here in QLD / Oz a Roadworthy Cert is only required when selling on a vehicle. Which means there are plenty driving around in 10yo vehicles which have never been tested since leaving the Dealership 😱. Honestly I’m not sure how it ‘works’, given modern Ins Companies reluctances to pay out, coupled with Joe Blogs tech knowledge / maintenance of his vehicle.
Personally I like the system, but then I tend to be meticulous about my vehicles.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: mike the bike on December 06, 2020, 09:03:46 AM
When I was a field service engineer, I used to keep track of how many missing brake lights I would see in a day.  It was rarely less than 12, my record being 29.
Most of these drivers would take their vehicles for a MOT like that without checking the lights.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Bryanj on December 06, 2020, 04:14:52 PM
To be honest when i was running old bangers i would not even change a bulb, just take it in and either fix what failed or scrap the car if too much cost, never let anything serious go but also mot'd every 6 months as at that time the failure did not overide the pass so i had time to fix it
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on December 08, 2020, 12:17:27 AM
To be honest when i was running old bangers i would not even change a bulb, just take it in and either fix what failed or scrap the car if too much cost, never let anything serious go but also mot'd every 6 months as at that time the failure did not overide the pass so i had time to fix it

An interesting point you raise about a failure overriding a pass when re-tested before the due expiry date - this line of argument seems to be propagated by testing stations that rightfully worry about duty of care to the customer.

My understanding is that the MoT is valid until it expires so a test failure does not actually invalidate the old test as a matter/point of law.  Also of course an MoT test is not proof of a vehicle roadworthiness. The issue then revolves as to the category of the failure as to if the vehicle can be legally used on a road to take it to a place of repair etc. If the existing MoT is "Overtrumped" by the Test failure the the VED would have to be refunded by DVLA  as it does not meet the requirement of having a valid test certificate

Similar uncertainties  surround the validity of Insurance with regards to faults with a vehicles roadworthiness if say a tyre is below the legal limit or does not meet original specifications. In law Insurance Companies cannot escape Road Traffic Act Cover liability  once a certificate of insurance has been delivered to the insured person. If this was the case vehicle insurance companies would wiggle out of their responsibilities due to minor irregularities. (Yes they can dodge the comprehensive cover but not the Third Party Road Traffic aspect that is the only legal requirement) The obvious exception is where the driver/rider is disqualified or the policy has been obtained by a false declaration / deception.

To invalidate Third Party Cover the Insurance Company have to go through a legal process called "Voiding" the policy with a legal requirements to obtain the surrender of the Insurance Certificate from the insured party. At least this was the case when I worked in Police Prosecutions over 20 years ago. I concede  correction on the points raised if new legislation has changed caselaw.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: DaveN on December 10, 2020, 02:37:37 PM
Excellent points folks and well made.

My machine was put through an MoT after the restoration back in February just as a nuts-n-bolts check, but as I have yet to clock 1,000 miles in 10 months (I'm still running it in :-), I may well leave it until 2022 before another one.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Bryanj on December 10, 2020, 06:20:45 PM
Like i said 1 just after putting on road then not till majour work done
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: florence on December 11, 2020, 07:30:04 PM
I simply keep my historic vehicles in a good mechanical condition.  The MOT test was always pretty basic and my bike never failed in the past because I knew what was required to get it through.  There's not much point in having a test, it's always a massive inconvenience for me as there is nowhere local to have it done. With proper maintenance machinery is always going to be in good order.  I suspect 99.9% of historic vehicles are in much better condition than vehicles that still require an MOT (which is only valid on the day of the test) and, after all, we care and are interested in our vehicles; they wouldn't have lasted this long otherwise.  Our bikes are much more to us than transport, we are by definition enthusiasts, and I think that will always be worth much more than a generic test done by someone who normally only looks machinery made in the last decade or two.  It isn't very fair on testers to have to interpret regulations for vehicles that were manufactured sometimes up to over a hundred years ago and I'm sure the insurers find that the incidence of accidents involving vehicles over forty years old is statistically very small as a proportion of the whole.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: jonboo10 on December 13, 2020, 04:51:49 PM
 i would vote Not.Here in IOM when you import from UK you have a govt inspection before you can re-register and then no further tests as long as you keep the vehicle taxed at least 1 yr in 2. Govt test more through than a UK MOT . Thereafter its your responsibility to maintain roadworthyness.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Bryanj on December 13, 2020, 06:56:03 PM
Is that because there are no speed limits and few straights on the IOM
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Lobo on December 14, 2020, 11:19:05 AM
I lived in the IOM for a couple of years - beautiful spot. (Our daughter was born there). Local lore had it that you had to say, “Hello Fairies” as you crossed the Fairy Bridge from Castletown into Douglas. The one time we didn’t (too busy chatting).... I got a ticket for speeding.
So yep, back in 1986 there were certainly ‘limits.
Happy days...
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: philward on December 14, 2020, 12:14:34 PM
Lobo, you just reminded me about Fairy Bridge - used to always say Hello Fairies when going over the bridge when on holiday with my grandparents in the sixties!
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: billdn on December 14, 2020, 05:10:23 PM
Went to the TT in 1980 and didn't say hello to the fairies - fractured femur and written off bike! Ignore the folk lore at your peril!
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: MrDavo on December 14, 2020, 05:50:05 PM
Quote
So yep, back in 1986 there were certainly ‘limits.

During the Manx GP in 1993, we got a ticket in the Transit for breaking the 30mph limit at the end of the Sulby Straight. An hour earlier, in evening practice I had passed the very same copper on the CBR600 at over 150mph and he didn't even look up!

I believe that MOT standards in Eire used to be somewhat lax,  don't know about nowadays though.
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: TrickyMicky on December 14, 2020, 08:16:07 PM
TT Races 1972. Actually stopped to talk to the fairies, wish them all happiness, and could they bless us with a proper closed in car deck on the way home!!
Title: Re: MoT or Not?
Post by: Lobo on December 14, 2020, 10:41:09 PM
... that last pic Tricky reminds me of the car ferry aborting it’s approach into Douglas in wild weather (1985’ish?) with a sharp turn and the thing listing .... an awful lot. Carnage down on the bike deck, with 10’s of machines toppled like dominoes.
I don’t often fret on transports, but this time was definitely an, “ey up” moment as the lean got greater and greater 😱.
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