Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => Anorak's Corner => Topic started by: WestYorkshireBiker on June 30, 2020, 10:55:00 AM

Title: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: WestYorkshireBiker on June 30, 2020, 10:55:00 AM
Looking for a good quality tap n die set and don't want to get cheap eBay crap. Also what sets are needed for Honda's as I've read there's some JIS threads which have a different pitch to normal metric? The bike I'm getting I know for a fact has a broken head bolt so need help getting the right gear chaps. Thanks.

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Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Bryanj on June 30, 2020, 11:06:28 AM
Honda used some non prefered pitch threads, but still standard, in some places.
In all honesty i would buy just the sizes you need as some will need repair so you need helicoil kits anyway.

Most used size would be 6 x 1 and if its just a repair a plug tap will do but to tap a blind hole you need a taper first.

Tell me what you want to repair and ill tell you what sizes you need
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: WestYorkshireBiker on June 30, 2020, 11:10:11 AM
Honda used some non prefered pitch threads, but still standard, in some places.
In all honesty i would buy just the sizes you need as some will need repair so you need helicoil kits anyway.

Most used size would be 6 x 1 and if its just a repair a plug tap will do but to tap a blind hole you need a taper first.

Tell me what you want to repair and ill tell you what sizes you need
Thanks. I don't have the bike yet but I'm getting some tools etc bought so I'll probably just get a standard set and buy what I need when I need it I guess. It's more what decent makes to look for tbh. Amazon and eBay recommendations seem to vary on whatever I look at.

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Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Laverda Dave on June 30, 2020, 11:10:59 AM
If you want a selection of taps and dies Tracy Tools have some for £20. You can also call them for a chat to discuss exactly what you need. They have been around for years and are a reccomended source of quality engineering taps and dies. I've used them many times and never had a problem with the quality of their tools.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwikiOqIpanqAhUsQhUIHc5LDjQQFjAAegQIARAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tracytools.com%2F&usg=AOvVaw0SKoLqgxcwMYaqtZpNffdU
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: WestYorkshireBiker on June 30, 2020, 11:15:14 AM
If you want a selection of taps and dies Tracy Tools have some for £20. You can also call them for a chat to discuss exactly what you need. They have been around for years and are a reccomended source of quality engineering taps and dies. I've used them many times and never had a problem with the quality of their tools.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwikiOqIpanqAhUsQhUIHc5LDjQQFjAAegQIARAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tracytools.com%2F&usg=AOvVaw0SKoLqgxcwMYaqtZpNffdU
Perfect. Thanks Dave.

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Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: mickwinf on June 30, 2020, 12:36:48 PM
I have a set from Aldi, works well for occasional use. One thing to watch for is the 10mm size as most sets have a 1.5 thread pitch and hondas use a 1.25 fine pitch. As Laverda Dave said, tracy tools very good for this type of thing
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: K2-K6 on June 30, 2020, 12:50:54 PM
General recommendation to go with the tools mentioned above

 https://www.bearingboys.co.uk/Rocol/Rocol-RTD-Compound-50g-53020-167584-p?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2aeDvrqp6gIVQ-7tCh2-BwBgEAQYAiABEgL3PvD_BwE

Still the finest thread cutting lubricant known to man  ;D ;D ;D

Makes the best thread finish,  refined cut and least "oversize" final threads by reducing tool drag during use. Well worthwhile.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: philward on June 30, 2020, 12:58:15 PM
I've had this on watch on ebay for some time - keep bottling out as would only use occasionally
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DRAPER-75-Pce-Metric-Tap-Wrench-Split-Die-Coarse-Fine-Thread-Set-M2-M12-79205/391740316201?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Bryanj on June 30, 2020, 01:39:55 PM
When we get back to "normal" a good idea is to rumage at autojumbles, steam fairs etc so you get a day out and buy quality stuff Presto is a good name
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: sprinta on June 30, 2020, 02:09:53 PM
I've had this on watch on ebay for some time - keep bottling out as would only use occasionally
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DRAPER-75-Pce-Metric-Tap-Wrench-Split-Die-Coarse-Fine-Thread-Set-M2-M12-79205/391740316201?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Made from Carbon Steel not High Speed Steel, HSS.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: ka-ja on June 30, 2020, 02:22:30 PM
For drills and taps etc. Dormer and Warrior and SKS used to be the bees knees.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: JamesH on June 30, 2020, 05:14:24 PM
I have this set. Not cheap, but will last me a lifetime...


Laser 4554 Metric Tap & Die Set 110pc https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002TW7GE0/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_ft2-EbHFJYJ7C
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: davefirestorm on June 30, 2020, 06:07:23 PM
I’d invest in a thread gauge to determine the pitch of threads (you will possibly find 10mm bolts in 1.00,1.25,1.5 pitches) then just buy the taps/dies you need and buy quality  not cheap tat from China😁 I look for them at Autojumbles but make sure they’re not chipped/blunt had most of mine for years Dormer,Presto,SKF good makes and as stated look for HSS.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: SumpMagnet on June 30, 2020, 06:25:43 PM
I shop from here:

https://www.tracytools.com/taps-and-dies

I started with a basic cheap and nasty set...but soon saw the limitations and staterted buying quality taps for the threads I used a lot.

cheap onews don;t cut clean threads, and you really will notice the difference
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: davefirestorm on June 30, 2020, 06:37:06 PM
Also invest in some decent tapping oil/grease I use Trefolex it smells lovely😁
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: AshimotoK0 on June 30, 2020, 08:30:06 PM
Well here is one definitely NOT to buy. An engineer where I work said one day that the firm had bought a tap & die set German quality and I would never be stuck for a metric odd-ball size tap or die again.

Fast forward a year and I found the remains of it in the big wheelie rubbish bit at work, less it's wrenches & die holders. I was told by everyone who had used it that the quality was sh*te. of course I blagged it from the bin and it's useful for clearing out threads but no use for heavy duty 'normal' engineeering use.

My main set just consists of items bought  from Autojumbles & car boots. Just look for Dormer, Hall, Presto, Guhring and you can't go wrong IMHO.

Here is the remains of the SH*TE set :-

[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: WestYorkshireBiker on June 30, 2020, 08:32:28 PM
Thanks. Brilliant info.

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Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Tomb on July 01, 2020, 09:23:36 AM
Trying to not get involved, I say with a twitch. Tom (Toolmaker - OCD flaring up as I type)

Did someone mention Trefolex? mmmmm I can smell it now, still have a tin in my garage. Wasn't it dropped for health and safety reasons?

Tallow. mmmmm.
Hate the smell of the ROCOL tapping lube, even washing hands won't get the smell off.


Run as fast as you can from CARBON STEEL!!!! only HSS
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: adespin on July 01, 2020, 03:29:19 PM
 I have used these in the past, not cheap but always top quality. https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjGvM6GnqzqAhVpSxUIHRQ4BScQFjAAegQIAhAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.chronos.ltd.uk%2F&usg=AOvVaw2jOkgyA5ll_kom8wVQN_1p
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: davefirestorm on July 01, 2020, 03:29:33 PM
Recall a cancer scare Regards Rocol way back in 80s but formula changed and they retained the horrendous pong too ,I have a tin of Trefolex obtained years ago which I use spareingly when tapping brings back memories of Tech college when doing apprenticeship 😁
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: mike the bike on July 01, 2020, 07:28:35 PM
I find that the sets are half full of stuff that you'll never ever use.  It's probably best to invest in individual, good quality taps in the sizes that you'll need.  And make a box for them.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Rob62 on July 05, 2020, 07:56:44 PM
Avoid carbon steel, go for hss (high speed steel)....
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: Moorey on July 05, 2020, 08:22:28 PM
Trefolex is still readily available. A tin at home will last forever.  ;)
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: jshonda on August 30, 2020, 06:25:44 PM
With taps and dies, you get what you pay for. Go for known brands like Warrior, Presto, etc. They must be HSS, and slpit diesso you can 'fernurgle' a thread as required, Buy as you require or you will be paying for tools you don't use (trust me, I have tools people have never even heard of). Over the years my collection of t's & d's include metric course, up tp 25mm, many metric fine up to 26mm, bsf, bsp, whitworth, unc, unf, ba, and a full set of Venezuelan Beaver's Trap thread! (and many specials,some l/hand thread). Yup, a man can't live without taps and dies!
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: WestYorkshireBiker on August 30, 2020, 06:26:50 PM
With taps and dies, you get what you pay for. Go for known brands like Warrior, Presto, etc. They must be HSS, and slpit diesso you can 'fernurgle' a thread as required, Buy as you require or you will be paying for tools you don't use (trust me, I have tools people have never even heard of). Over the years my collection of t's & d's include metric course, up tp 25mm, many metric fine up to 26mm, bsf, bsp, whitworth, unc, unf, ba, and a full set of Venezuelan Beaver's Trap thread! (and many specials,some l/hand thread). Yup, a man can't live without taps and dies!
Thanks. Pretty much doing that. Just buying what I need.

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Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: commando1954 on September 10, 2021, 05:54:30 PM
Make sure that the dies are split ones so you can adjust them and the set has metric fine sizes as well.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: matthewmosse on September 10, 2021, 08:05:21 PM
If just cleaning threads a crap set of plug or bottoming taps and dies is ok, not the very crappiest, they might not even be the right size! Having a good selection of metric fine and standard threads is st that stage more useful than boxes of extremely expensive top notch gear. That's if your just rebuilding a standard bike, in my opinion at any rate. Decent taps and dies are however very worthwhile if you start making parts from scratch, but go down that road and a lathe is surely also essential, plus welding and oxy acetylene gear. Soon the bikes get kicked out to another shed if you go down that route. I'd just buy the toos as required but a Tracey tools basic tap and die set is a good investment, despite a filing cabinet of better presto etc kit, my go to tap and die set is still the tracy tools basic £20 or so blue box of taps and dies for inperial, for metric I have a similar set by Sealey, while I'm very happy with their pro line sockets and spanners, their m6 to m24 metric fine and coarse tap and die set is not that good to be honest, tap and die wrenches fragile, taps fine for basic work but the bigger sizes I've needed to re grind using a diamond burr to even get to start cutting a thread, it was that or drill out to a larger size than stated in my Zeus bible, by almost 1mm. Not very good for fabrication, absolutely fine for thread cleaning.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: ka-ja on September 11, 2021, 09:43:30 AM
The quality of tools an individual buys should be governed by their use, and while a good few mid-range tools are great for the home mechanic, tools for use in industry on a daily basis, have to be far superior to home use tools. Apart from the safety aspects of heavy usage, "professional" tools lessen the need for constant replacement of worn out or broken tools that are in constant use.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: fogrider on September 11, 2021, 04:39:37 PM
I now only buy HQSS taps and dies from The Tap-die Company in London. He will  ALWAYS insist you buy a full set, but as someone said earlier, just buy the ones you need. ( he does give in and sells you singles ! ).  Tap-die full sets are mighty expensive, but they're the best I've ever used. Cut stainless perfectly.
His website is worth a look for the info he has on it.
Regards from sunny Hull.
Terry.
Title: Re: Tap n die set recommendations
Post by: ST1100 on March 05, 2023, 10:54:19 AM
I found use of a designated drilling and cutting oil extremely helpful... even with relatively cheap bits...
The stuff I'm using sticks to the bits like honey and extends the lifetime of all drills, taps and dies massively...
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