Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB500/550 => Topic started by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 12:44:39 PM

Title: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 12:44:39 PM
I am about to start recommissioning my 500/4 K0 which i have owned for 34 years. It was last on the road in 1984. It was registered in Apr 72 and is 100% original. I have been told that K0 500/4s were never 'officially' imported into the UK. What exactly does this mean please and how would this bike have been likely to have arrived here. Many thanks for any info you may be able to give me. Regards, David M
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 12, 2017, 01:44:07 PM
Welcome to the mad world of the SOHC.
There were only 3 K0's bought in officially as press bike, a gold, a black and a brown one. The others were grey imports brought in by dealers direct from Japan or Europe and then changed to UK spec, as the K0 was never available here and the high demands before the release of the K1  . Which are the 3 press bikes is a big question and I have searched for the answer for years.
Even the grey import units are rare to find these days. I have fully restored a K0 about 4 years ago .
Any pictures of the bike would help.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 02:07:48 PM
Thank you Trigger , that 's very interesting. I will try to attach some pics. Would either the frame or engine numbers be of any help. I am 100% sure that this is an original UK K0 and as i said, it's condition is also totally original. I also have the original log book. I am new to this so please bear with me. Cheers, David
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Jamesh_sussex on October 12, 2017, 03:35:03 PM
David - if you're struggling to get pics up by all means email them to me or another member and we can post for you whilst you're learning the ropes. Be good to see the bike and hear your plans for it..
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 03:56:52 PM
Thank you James. I did post a couple of pics on another site (VJMC) i think, about a year ago. It was you who identified it as a K0 and i confirmed this via engine/frame nos. Unfortunately ill health has prevented me from commencing the project until now. I will post pics tomorrow and look forward to learning more about the bike. Regards, David
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Bryanj on October 12, 2017, 04:33:28 PM
I have a fairly comprehensive list of frame/engine numbers with build dates if you PM the details i will see where it fits. Is there a Vin plate on the RH side of the headstock yo go along with the stamped number on the LH side?
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: K2-K6 on October 12, 2017, 04:54:21 PM
Would this one for in anywhere,  supposed to be 1974
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Jamesh_sussex on October 12, 2017, 05:58:53 PM
Thank you James. I did post a couple of pics on another site (VJMC) i think, about a year ago. It was you who identified it as a K0 and i confirmed this via engine/frame nos. Unfortunately ill health has prevented me from commencing the project until now. I will post pics tomorrow and look forward to learning more about the bike. Regards, David
Hi David. Yes I do remember speaking with on the VJMC facebook page. Glad you finally made it here.

There are loads of 500 specialists on here (I'm not one of them) so you're in good company...hope your health is improving and you find some time to crack on with the 500 ...James
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 12, 2017, 08:48:05 PM
Registration of April 1972 is too early for a press bike. The release of the K1 in the UK would of been 1st August 1972.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 08:57:22 PM
Thanks Trigger. I will post more details tomorrow when i dig out the log book. I am quoting from memory which has been known to be wrong !!!! I will also post all relevant numbers. If it is pre press bikes would it have been a grey import? By the way, it is gold and black. Do you know when the press bikes arrived in the UK? Cheers, David
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 12, 2017, 09:21:35 PM
Honda are the hardest people to get any information from. Is it GTT 131K ? This was not a press bike but was used by Honda in sales sheets.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: AshimotoK0 on October 12, 2017, 09:29:39 PM
Welcome !!  ...Not a UK bike in this review ... they used Swedish one.... and  before someone starts banging on  :)..yea it's got Made in Japan stickers (same colour as Menno did mine ... has a blue metallic coat under the candy ... work that one out).

[attachimg=1][attachimg=2][attachimg=3]
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 09:32:02 PM
LRB453K Trigger. Am i right in thinking they First appeared in Feb 72 at the London bike show, and would this have been a K0 on display?
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 12, 2017, 09:46:45 PM
Sorry LRR453K
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 12, 2017, 09:47:35 PM
Never seen any pictures of the 500 at the London bike show. Doubt it would have been a UK spec one that early as they took about six months to get here back then.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Seabeowner on October 13, 2017, 12:13:47 PM
Bike show pics from MM March 72. Exhibition RHS halls Jan 72. Anyone remember these shows?  Went a couple of times.

And just to add to the K0 thread. Not it's not very clear in the shots if it has stickers on the side panels.
BUT in the full length shot of Jon and the lady (who is sitting halfway up the tank with her right leg on the tacho), it is clear (just) that it does have the stickers.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: SteveD CB500F on October 13, 2017, 12:29:21 PM
I did a couple of RHS shows in the Ltd 70s when I was a student in Brighton. It was the Racing & Sporting show.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: AshimotoK0 on October 13, 2017, 01:12:13 PM
Wonder if it's the same Show Dick was at.
[attach=1]

Incidentally,via Facebook.  for my register  of UK bikes, a guy called Mick who was the workshop foreman at Freddie Frith's in Grimsby sent me this about Dick Emery (Dick went on to buy CB750K0 BYU762H)

Mick:-Dick was appearing in Cleethorpes and came to our shop, Freddie Frith Ltd in Grimsby one afternoon and was shown around the new CB750 by Freddie himself before riding it up and down our yard with Freddie on the back! 😊

Ashley Derrick Wow brilliant bit of info there Mick !

Mick:  There is a picture of the event somewhere Ashley , just wish I could remember where! 😁

Ashley Derrick:- His bike was an early import. Mine I owned at one time was from 1st batch in Jan '70.... seems he probably sussed one out in Grimsby whilst on tour, liked it and went on to buy one in Surbiton from Tippetts. Any details of the bikes you got in Mick ? Colour ..how many ? Dates .. as I am putting together a document register of early UK models ..mine came from Alan Mountains in York. He registered two on the same day in 1970 mine was red.

Mick :- Crikey, you got me now Ashley, what I do remember is that the very first one we sold went to the Woodhouse brothers who bought it so they could take the engine out and put it in a racing sidecar outfit. They rode the Honda engined outfit at the TT and as I recall they traded in a 350 Manx Norton for it. At the same time we were Norton agents and sold far more Commandos than Cb750s 😊

Ashley Derrick:-  Wow !!! you confirmed my snippet that an early one was broken out of the crate to to make a sidecar outfit Mick. I know that Queens Park Motors in Salford broke one out of the crate pretty early on for spares as the spares cost was astronomic and hard to get hold of. Frith's must have been a pretty prestigious dealer to get hold of them so early. I know Mountains regularly won trips to Japan because they sold so many Honda step-throughs to Rowntrees/Terry's/BR workers in York. So I guess they were pretty high up on the pecking order.

Mick :- Freddie himself won a trip to Japan, I remember him going. Frith's was the biggest dealership in the town and I ended up being workshop foreman there. I'm 71 now but still have a Cb750 K1 but don't ride it as often as I should. It has a Motad exhaust but a proper system costs far too much for an oap! 😁

Ashley Derrick:- Better than money in the bank if it's a genuine UK K1 Mick ! I was lucky enough to get one of the last set of Genuine HM300 pipes before Honda discontinued them a few years back and the price rocketed on the likes of eBay.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 13, 2017, 02:08:18 PM
I did a couple of RHS shows in the Ltd 70s when I was a student in Brighton. It was the Racing & Sporting show.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The Racing and Sporting Show is correct  ;)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 13, 2017, 04:38:11 PM
OK gents, the relevant info is, Frame No, CB5001014901.  Engine No CB500E1015267. The bike was first registered on the 10/05/1972. This is as per the log book and correct on the bike.
On another note, because of my arthritis i am having to buy a Clarke hydraulic bike bench (currently VAT free at machine mart).Simple question, are they any good? Many thanks, David
Bryanj, there is no vin plate on the headstock opposite to the frame number. Just a silver and black Honda Motor Co Made in Japan sticker Again, Thanks
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Woodside on October 13, 2017, 05:10:58 PM
there seems to be a handfull of uk k0 500's about..
they do seem to fall into that vin number range...
there must have been a very small batch that found its way to blighty
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Seabeowner on October 13, 2017, 05:23:54 PM
The VIN plate on the UK K1s was on the frame tube on the RHS to the rear of the side panel. Don't know about K0.
Sounds like manuf. about June 71 as my import is a few thousand higher and marked July.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Jamesh_sussex on October 13, 2017, 05:43:24 PM
I've had a workbench from Machine Mart in the past (Clarke), and although not pro-standard they are very good value for the price in my opinion...
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 13, 2017, 05:45:45 PM
Very close to your Black K0 woodside.
Nothing wrong with a Clarke bench, there is a thread on them not long ago.
No VIN plate on the UK 500 fours  ;)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Seabeowner on October 13, 2017, 06:38:19 PM
Trigger, Is that VIN plate on the rear tube only on bikes to other markets? My UK K1 bike does not have one but it's powder coated and just thought it got removed and was thinking of getting one. There are a number of sellers selling the plates for UK bikes.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 13, 2017, 07:41:04 PM
Trigger, Is that VIN plate on the rear tube only on bikes to other markets? My UK K1 bike does not have one but it's powder coated and just thought it got removed and was thinking of getting one. There are a number of sellers selling the plates for UK bikes.

Not sounding like a parrot, the UK CB500 K1 never came with a VIN plate anywhere on the bike  ;) It did come on the UK CB550 F1 and F2 on the rear tube, Oh and the K3  :)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 13, 2017, 07:46:01 PM
A picture for David M. This is the Only fully restored UK CB500KO that I know of.
[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Woodside on October 13, 2017, 08:11:23 PM
did you put the crash bars on trigg
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: DavidM on October 13, 2017, 08:12:02 PM
That's fantastic Trigger and something to aim for. I have the same engine crash bars and a period 'screen flow' topbox (think i'll give that a miss)
Should i rechrome the rims which are corrosion (and chrome) free, or go for new with stainless spokes? Now the questions have started ha ha.
 Huge gratitude for all your input. David M
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Woodside on October 13, 2017, 08:15:15 PM
noooo not stainless spokes...
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: matthewmosse on October 13, 2017, 08:15:53 PM
The photo will be a handy reference, I also have a k0, UK bike but its in bits in the loft as I bought it to break for parts - for my younger cb500/4 but wound up deciding it's better left for a future restorer when I 're assemble it. I'll not tackle a restoration as the bank balance wouldn't stand that plus I prefer my bikes to look their age and not worry about them picking up a few marks or rust spots.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Woodside on October 13, 2017, 08:19:53 PM
matt i think your one is very close vin to the one that started this thead...its a nats hair from my black project...
these things are breeding
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 13, 2017, 08:43:12 PM
That's fantastic Trigger and something to aim for. I have the same engine crash bars and a period 'screen flow' topbox (think i'll give that a miss)
Should i rechrome the rims which are corrosion (and chrome) free, or go for new with stainless spokes? Now the questions have started ha ha.
 Huge gratitude for all your input. David M

The K0 in the picture was built as a usable bike, rebuilt the engine as the gear box had failed. The crash bars were a extra and the non STD parts are the stainless spokes, painted black hubs and the mirrors and it is still regularly in use today.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Bryanj on October 13, 2017, 10:46:18 PM
The vin quoted was probably BUILT in 11/71 as one starting 1048 was (US bike confirmed by vin plate)

That means it could be a late K0 or an early K1 as the model build year usually started late the year before so they could be on the sales floor early in the model year. My ID book gives start of model year numbers but i don't got it to hand

EDIT 2

Just found book, anything starting 1 is K0, 2 is K1 (starts 4/72), 21 is K2(unless in UK)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Jamesh_sussex on October 14, 2017, 12:02:32 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171013/b6fe1b884f8d67e53585c853ddf22c88.jpg)

I reckon yours is a 5/71 or 6/71 build??
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 14, 2017, 07:25:36 AM
The vin quoted was probably BUILT in 11/71 as one starting 1048 was (US bike confirmed by vin plate)

That means it could be a late K0 or an early K1 as the model build year usually started late the year before so they could be on the sales floor early in the model year. My ID book gives start of model year numbers but i don't got it to hand

EDIT 2

Just found book, anything starting 1 is K0, 2 is K1 (starts 4/72), 21 is K2(unless in UK)

The VIN quoted is 1014 Bryan, I would put that in around May 1971 build. Out of interest as you have number 36, what is the VIN build on your bike mate.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Bryanj on October 14, 2017, 10:09:31 AM
No 36 was 2/71 and I misread the post number as 104 so 1013 was 5/71 and 1016 7/71 so yes may would be somewhere handy. Apologies for mistake, i had been awake 28 hours by then!!
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: AndyH on October 14, 2017, 10:42:46 AM
Is this numbering scheme and dates only applicable to UK bikes?  If not, I'd like to throw my bike's numbers into the mix so to speak!
 
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Bryanj on October 14, 2017, 12:31:56 PM
No it isn't just UK bikes, in fact later UK bikes are bloody awkward as they are all K1's made alongside K2's for the rest of the world and what looks like a 72/73 number is in fact 75/76.

Please add your details, obviously you wont have a build date only a registered date but I can give you an estimate of build date although with the new rolling 40 year exemption it is now getting a bit academic as all the 500's are over 40 years old except for maybe a few imported 500K3(which never was officially imported to UK)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: AndyH on October 15, 2017, 08:00:29 AM
Engine: 2153097
Frame:  2064562

Seems to suggest I have a K1 frame with a K2 engine, but I honestly have no idea how AUS bikes were originally set up.
There is no compliance plate on the steering yoke, but I believe these didn't come into play until 1973 in AUS.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Trigger on October 15, 2017, 08:48:47 AM
Engine: 2153097
Frame:  2064562

Seems to suggest I have a K1 frame with a K2 engine, but I honestly have no idea how AUS bikes were originally set up.
There is no compliance plate on the steering yoke, but I believe these didn't come into play until 1973 in AUS.

I don't think you had a K2 in Australia ? So, the numbers worked the same as the UK. Frame 20 identifies it as a K1 and the Engine 21 is because it is a 1973, 1974 or 1975. Very common to see this and is original   ;)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: AndyH on October 15, 2017, 09:38:13 AM
Thanks for that Graham!  It's nice to know the bike isn't a "bitser"!
According to CMSNL's list, only the US got the K2.  I don't know how accurate that list is.  I imagine Bryan would have a pretty good idea though. :)
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: deltarider on October 15, 2017, 11:49:44 AM
Quote
Thanks for that Graham!  It's nice to know the bike isn't a "bitser"!
According to CMSNL's list, only the US got the K2. I don't know how accurate that list is. I imagine Bryan would have a pretty good idea though. :)
CMSNL's list is not perfect. For instance, there was a CB500K2 (ED, F, G) marketed in continental Europe in 1976 that is different from the earlier CB500K2 marketed in the US in 1973. Unfortunately CMSNL doesn't provide the fiches nor the Parts List, but... there's Honda4Fun that does: http://www.honda4fun.com/pdf_parts_list/pdf_spac500/CB500-76/CB500-76_1.pdf
When I compare the numbers you posted to the serial numbers on p.4 of that Parts List, yours is not a CB500K2 (ED, F, G). Nevertheless I thought it a good idea to inform readers there was such a model. At http://www.honda4fun.com/materiale-documentazione-tecnica/parts-list/parts-list-cb500 you'll find all CB500 Parts List. The serial engine- and frame numbers are in the first few pages of every list, so you can pick the right one. When you go through the list, there's the area code to observe. They are also listed in the first few pages of every list. The area code for Australia is "U".
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Nurse Julie on October 15, 2017, 12:04:15 PM
Just out if interest Delta, do you own Honda4fun or work on a commission from them?, as you reference them regularly. I have rarely found anything on the site that I haven't been able to find elsewhere, and as with most other sites their information can be totally misleading at times.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: deltarider on October 15, 2017, 12:21:00 PM
Quote
Just out if interest Delta, do you own Honda4fun or work on a commission from them?, as you reference them regularly.
No, I don't own it and as far as I know nobody works on a commission. It's a site just like this here. IMO they're best in providing documentation. They have proved me to take this very serious from the beginning. What a strange question, if you allow me to say. 
Quote
have rarely found anything on the site that I haven't been able to find elsewhere,
O, there's lots. Here's an example: scroll down http://www.honda4fun.com/home/faq/generali/111-cb500-differenze-k0-k1-k2 Apart from that, they offer the most comprehensive collection Parts Lists for the CB500/550 series. Most of them are in paper edition on my desk, btw. But maybe you're right. By now a lot must have been copied by others.
Quote
and as with most other sites their information can be totally misleading at times.
I'm confident you'll give us examples to substantiate you allegation. In the meanwhile can I be of any assistance with a specific question you have right now? Do you happen to  speak/read Italian? French maybe? I have a very good 100p. document about the CB500/550 in French. It's 163.879 kb however.
Title: Re: CB500/4 K0 UK bike
Post by: Nurse Julie on October 15, 2017, 12:29:45 PM
My question was not an allegation, it was a question, it is how I learn. No, I don't speak Italian, I find I can gain enough information from the English written language, and no, I do not wish to provide a specific example or for you to provide a specific answer as it was a generalised observation.