Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: Greg65 on January 18, 2018, 06:14:03 PM
-
Oh dear oh dear Julie, what have you started!
My wife is convinced I’ve got an internet girlfriend as all she hears is my god Julie is fantastic, she snatches the iPad and sees pictures of engine bits. I then get accused of closing what ever I had been looking at previously! Oh well.
Anyway you have given me the confidence to persue the camchain tensioner suspicions. So far I have the head and barrels off and getting stuck into the cleaning. All this is leading to the first of many questions for the experts.
First up. The circlip that retains the tacho drive. How do I remove it?
Second. Cleaning carbon off exhaust valves. Have tried soaking in diesel for a few days. It’s still solid and reluctant to go to physical with it. Also cleaning up the piston which is a much softer metal, advice please.
Also may I must add my thanks and admiration for a really good thread and finish you have achieved. I now understand why you moved from Kent to be very near Trigger. ;D
-
Haha Greg, your wife need only start worrying if you and I start swapping fairy cake recepies or discussing nail varnish colours.......worried for you that is, not me ;D ;D
The tacho circlip should come out easily enough, it is easily accessible, just keep digging. Try soaking the valves and pistons in thinners, it should remove most of the carbon which will be a start.
No, I didn't move up this way to be close to Trig, although it is very handy when it comes to engine building, we moved up from Kent together ;) ;)
Good luck with your project, you will enjoy it.
-
I have a Kentish lady from Stodmarsh, one is enough.
I have found the circlip for the tacho drive. Now does anyone know if I push it into the cylinder head cover or rotate it and pull it off with pliers?
Will pick up some thinners tomorrow.
Thanks,
Greg
-
I have a Kentish lady from Stodmarsh, one is enough.
I have found the circlip for the tacho drive. Now does anyone know if I push it into the cylinder head cover or rotate it and pull it off with pliers?
Will pick up some thinners tomorrow.
Thanks,
Greg
Rotate and pull off with long nose pliers.
-
Can i have some opinions on my cam shaft please.
-
and the other half.
All the other bearings are similar. Use, refurbish or a pile of scrap?
-
It really depends on how much you want to spend and more importantly what you intend using the bike for when it’s done. In an ideal world you would either replace the camshaft, head and cover with new. Another route would be to have the cam metal sprayed and reground to size but the head and cover are almost impossible to reclaim due to the specialist machine Honda used to produce them - they can’t be line bored with those blind ends.
Now to the real world: I’ve seen much worse on nicely running bikes and if this bike is only going to be used carefully and not on a daily commute of hundreds of miles and providing the measured radial bearing clearance is within limits then I personally would use those parts again. The other question I would have is are you replacing, or at least checking big ends and mains and oil pump - they have had the same diet of contaminated oil?
I’m sure Trig will have strong views on this
Ian
-
Thanks Ian. I will get the micrometer across the part tomorrow and post the details.
Now back to the tacho drive. After a bit of a wash the circlip stuck it’s nose out far enough to come out easily. Any tips on how to release the old seal as it seems to be “welded”, or to I just dig in.
Thanks,
Greg
-
Put a flat blade screwdriver through the hole and on the the underside of the lip and prise it up, if it doesn't budge, pick at it. I had a seal that was well stuck in place, got it all out in the end.....in 87 little bits ;D ;D
-
Orcadian. Yes the big ends will be inspected and bearings replaced. I will also strip and replace seal in the oil pump. The cam measures within limits so I will reuse.
VHT paint. Rattle cans, if so how many will I need? Or use a spray gun, if so which paint is recommended?
The copper washers that are used on the cylinder head, can they be annealed and reused?
Thanks Greg
-
The copper washers can be annealed if they are solid copper. Mine were copper covered steel so I reused them. 8 'O' rings needed for total overhaul of oil pump, I sell the kits if you need one. (Obviously you don't have to buy a kit from me, if you don't want to !!!!)
-
My CB750 tacho drive oil seal was leaking, rock hard with age and stuck.
Following advice from this forum, I think, I drilled a tiny hole in it and screwed in a small self tapper. That was to give me the purchase to pull the bugger out with pliers, IIRC what actually happened was that when the self tapper bottomed out in the blind hole, continuing to screw it forced the seal off its seat and out towards me - it was then lobsided but I got a small screwdriver in behind it and popped it out.
I've seen far worse than your cam bearings in sweet running engines, if it ain't (that) broken don't fix it.
Ive scraped carbon off valves plenty of times, just stay away from damaging the seating surface and stems. I've even cleaned them up with emery cloth and a blunt screwdriver end after putting them in a drill chuck, protecting the stem with a bit of rag, probably not best practice but it has worked for me.
-
How is it that such a small part can cause so much grief. Going for the Julie 87 bit removal process I’ve managed to remove the front third of the seal, still welded. Applied penetrating oil and tried flexing the seal by applying pressure with a screw driver between the tacho drive and the cam cover to push it out. Got some movement so thought I would pull using the pliers. WRONG.... I now have a broken shaft, oh for f#&%£ sake. Any one got a used one for sale? Finally removed the remains.
Yes Julie would love a set of seals for the oil pump, thanks, PM sent.
My wife casually mentioned that a friend of hers husband rebuilds old car engines and has a small engineering business. So after an introduction I’m visiting a workshop with measuring devices that I do not posses next week with a selection of parts. This hopefully will give me a good idea on the condition of the bores and general condition of the engine my inexperienced eye does not have.
I now have a nice set of clean valves which are in good condition. The shafts all measure well within limits, showing little or no wear. Thanks for all the advice.
-
I may have a spare shaft, I will go in the workshop and look after I have cooked dinner.
-
I think you may have had the original Oil seal fitted Greg, a metal band encased in rubber, like this one
[attachimg=1]
No point crying over spilt milk, it just so happens I am giving away a replacement with every CB400 oil pump O ring kit this month......limited supply, last one left ;D ;D ;D
[attachimg=2]
-
After 40 years I think it was settled, didn’t take kindly to the eviction.
Thank you so much. Drop me a PM on how you would like paying, don’t forget postage.
Greg
-
PM sent Greg
-
Can't resist adding to this thread, even though I'm adding no value at all....
I tried all sorts to remove my tacho drive oil seal. In the end, I gave up (without seeking advice from this forum - mistake - and without the imagination to try the techniques recommended so far in this thread). In the end, it went to the vapour blasting people still in place. I eventually rebuilt the engine and today, three years later, it still runs fine with the barest trace of an oil leak from the tacho drive!
Gosh these things were built to last (unlike the UK competition at the time, sadly).
Cheers, D.
-
Probably on of the fiddliest jobs on the whole bike .... apart from the brake master cylinder rebuild?
It does look like it was designed to stay put for life....so I considered leaving it alone ..... but then I found I could get a new seal from DSS and thought "that £££ing seal will only start dribbling oil at some future date so out out it must come !
My thinking was that the shaft, bush and seal were pressed in so should come out by some means.
Rather than risking damage to the casting I gambled that the shaft should be strong enough along its axis at least to push the bush and seal out.
After a bit fiddling I got the circlip off - using two small screwdrivers I think?
I can remember having stop it trying to turn in the groove as I did this.... took a few attempts too.
Once the circlip ws off there's nothing to keep the shaft and bush in place but the seal I assumed , although that will have been sitting in the cover for years..overnight soak with plus-gas helped.
Used a bigger screwdriver blade wrapped in some tape and wedged it between the end face of the gear and the recess in the cover and "eased" the shaft and bush out complete with the seal. Maybe I got lucky?!
-
Progress and a temporary stop.
Visited an engine restorers yesterday with the cylinders and head. The bores all measured up well with minimal wear, I even got them deglazed. He cast his eyes across the cam shaft and passed them as fit for continued use and the head was flat. So all round good news, an interesting visit to a professional workshop and some really good tips on the rebuild.
So got stuck in this morning with the intention of getting the case split. All going great until the part which said “use the clutch tool...”. Missed that so now need to order one, oh well looks like I will have to do some decorating instead. :(
-
Finally found time to continue the engine strip. A very satisfying moment when I got my hands on the cam chain tensioner, this being the suspect area that has lead me to strip the engine. At some time the chain has come into contact with the horse shoe at the pivot point. This has burred over the bracket and pinched the horseshoe preventing any further movement. After applying pressure it freed up and a careful clean with a needle file it’s free and functional. The only other area for concern is the drum stopper plate which shows considerable wear. I can find no obvious cause for it but would appreciate advice.
Thanks,
Greg
-
That looks OK to me Greg by what I can see in the pic. They do have one very 'flat' pointed side, if you get my drift.
Edit
This is what they look like new Greg
[attachimg=1]
-
The oracle has spoken.
Thanks Julie, your soothing bed manner works wonders,
Greatly appreciated,
Greg
-
That darn cam tensioner.. nice fix. !
-
Ok, spent a chilly hour or so reading the various marks on the crankshaft and connecting rods.
So on the crankshaft I have, 1A, 1A, 1B, 1B, 1?
Connecting rods, 3D, 2D, 2D, 2D
Three of the big end shells have the code D6I-A STD and seem to have a hint of green on the side, the other has code D6F-A STD red/brown?
Can someone please confirm which shells I have?
Thanks, Greg
-
On top of what Oddjob says, the markings on the shells mean nothing.
-
Sorry Oddjob forgot.
ABABA.
Cheers,
Greg
-
Thanks for that Oddjob, I think I now understand the table and what it’s telling.
Cheers
-
Hi Greg. Do you need yellow shells? Some for sale, 6 in total.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-Pleuel-Lager-Schale-gelb-CB-350f-Four-CB-400f-13318-333-003-Neu/302667149421?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-PAIRE-DE-COUSSINETS-VILO-NEUFS-JAUNE-HONDA-CB-350-400-FOUR-REF-13318-333-003/172889862294?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
-
Thanks for the heads up Deano, I appreciate the thought. They all came out in good condition and well within limits. I am replacing the big ends and sourced all I need.
Cheers, happy bolting one and all.
Greg
Edited for typo.