Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: Integra99 on January 12, 2018, 10:06:34 AM
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Before the strip down the bike ran great.. and gears were spot on (one of the better aspects) however since stripping the bike I've come to install the chain and gear selector and for some reason I've lost the spring back between gear selctions.
It will go into 1st and Neutral, but on selecting 1st, if I pull up the lever sticks in position rather than spring back to its original position. Its ok selecting down to 1st but it sticks going up. Strangely my Kickstart that worked lovely also now does not retract.
I know the gear selector spring is prone for going but odd that it was working.. could it be lack of oil as the engine has been fully drained and moved all over the place so perhaps the seal has dried up.. and it hasnt been run in gear at all?
Any ideas..before I start pulling apart?
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You'll have to pull the clutch cover to see what's going on with the kick start return and gear selection control - look's a bit messy with the various levers and cams. but it's relatively simple and just take note of where each of the bolts come from and where the various springs locate. You;ll have to do that anyway if you're going to split the crank cases to fix the cam chain tensioner problem that you have !
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Thanks Andut.. the Cam chain is ok.. we replaced the chain as the old one was really stretched and all seems good runs silky smooth.
Does the entire gear selector remove from the clutch side, I assume this is the case. I'll pop the cover off over the weekend and take a look, its odd considering it all worked fine previously.
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Yes, all of the operating mech is fitted inside the right hand cover, even the long shaft that the gear lever remote attaches to comes out that way. There a some quite strong springs which hook around various levers and solid abutments inside the case plus a fairly light hairpin spring. I don’t think you can rearrange everything if somethings wrong without removing the clutch assembly though as it’s all behind it.
It looks complicated but breaks down into logical units if you study it.
Ian
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It may be worth you going through the photos on Julie's 400 rebuild thread to see if you can recognise any parts or assembly routine that differ to your own buildup.
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Thanks guys much appreciated.
Well this is the odd thing the engine hasn't been apart, she is a low mileage bike and ran well prior to what was supposed to be a gentle restoration, the gears changed lovely and the kickstart was very operational. Now the engine has been out and sat in various positions.. the clutch was new before and all worked but only the clutch cover has been off in this time. So it was all working.. nothing has been dismantled hence its strange that in that time something has happened.
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Are you trying the gears with the engine running......I expect not as you say it has no oil in it. You may find the gear selection would be ok if you spin the wheel and try and select the gears.
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Thanks Julie I'm hoping this is the case as mechanically I cannot see whats changed... frustrating as starting to look quite good! I plan to run her up tomorrow and will pop in gear and get everything moving.
(http://www.dotheton.com/gallery/107242-120118033153.jpeg)
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I reckon Julie may be right. I had my 400 engine professionally rebuilt... and finally had it all bolted into the frame, ready to go. At this point I noted similar probs to what you describe, frozen gear selection etc. Called the engine builder in vague anger as I was in no mood to take it all out again. Anyways... oil in, wheel worked back & forth ...and bingo. Good luck.
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Thanks.. I do hope this is the case . mechanically she shifted perfectly before the engine was out which has been subjected to lots of work and being painted so fully drained of oil and so she hasnt turned a gear yet. I just need to secure the chain and then I can run up on a stand and get some oil moving!
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Solved the problem, phew!
Strangely my kickstart wasn't returning properly as well so took the clutch cover off and spring.. !!! something clicked back into place and i have a working gear selector and kickstart. The new seal I put in was too tight and the kick start spline and caused the gear selector to stick.
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Well done, we love a happy ending.
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Just a follow on question from this thread.
Having just bolted the two crankcase covers together and re-attached all the gear selector gubbins I thought I would go through all the gears to make sure they work.
When the engine is upright,I can get 1st.
When engine turned upside down I can get 1st,N,2nd and 3rd.
Question(s):
Do I need to worry about not getting 4th,5th & 6th in a 'dry run' with the engine on the bench? Is lack of sufficient lubrication the issue as previously suggested.
Will the gears work correctly once under load?
Will I need to undo what I have done so far and get them working before proceeding any further?
This is my first engine strip and rebuild so I don't know if I am worrying too much or not.
Thanks
PS Big thanks to Julie for her posts.Massive help
PPS What is the easiest way to put photos on? I tried once but didn't manage it
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Do they engage if you rotate the output shaft (where the sprocket goes) they won't normally engage unless you rotate that shaft, or the crank if you haven't fitted the clutch yet.
Sent from my X6pro using Tapatalk
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Was just going to say that myself Hairy. ALL gears should be selectable with the engine in the upright position, as Hairy says by rotating the output shaft and selecting the gears up and down. OOps, just notices posted on Trigs board !!!
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Back in my own place now !!!. Lack of lubrication will make no difference, you should still be able to select all gears still. I wouldn't proceed any further until you find out why you can't get all gears.
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I have not been rotating either output shaft or crank while trying to engage gears-just using the gear selector shaft.
Should I be rotating either output or crank at the same time as trying to engage the gears?
The output shaft spins freely as does the countershaft and crank when I spin them individually.
Sorry to be such a numptie but Haynes does not explain all this,just-"check gears for operation"
I had no idea that finding neutral was so simple-look for the brass button in the neutral switch hole.Little things like that are SO useful to amateurs like me!
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I had no idea that finding neutral was so simple-look for the brass button in the neutral switch hole. Little things like that are SO useful to amateurs like me!
Being an amateur myself, that is why I posted little bits of info like that with pics, on my engine build thread, I thought I was the only person who didn't know about the brass button!!!. I must admit that even by rotating the output shaft, it still took me a while and plenty of wiggling to get everything in the correct place to be able to go from 1st to 6th and back down again. As Oddjob says, it depends where the dogs are sitting when you first start trying to locate the gears. Once you have everything in the correct place, you should be able to locate all gears no problem. I marked all the gear positions on the drum stopper plate (page 20 of my thread)so I knew where they were, it made things a lot easier and helped me visualise where things were internally!!! Keep up the good work.
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Thanks Hairy,Oddjob and Nurse Julie.
Did everything you all suggested and it all went according to plan :D
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Glad to hear it, on to the rest of the rebuild!
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Great, onwards and upwards now.