Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: tom400f on December 27, 2012, 04:06:13 PM
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I have never had these for my bike. Is it possible to get just the key or does the barrel have to be replaced?
Above the key hole is stamped the number "19" - otherwise the lock is anonymous. Then there is the metal disk riveted on, which I assume has to be drilled out to remove the barrel if keys cannot be obtained separately.
Apologies for rubbish picture
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You could ask a GOOD Honda dealer like D.S.S. if you can get one from the frame number. Failing that I dont really know. What I do know is that just drilling out the rivet does NOT free the barrel, as it needs to be turned with the key about an eighth of a turn anti clockwise to be able to disengage a tongue on the inside end of the barrel to release it from the headstock. Thankfully the barrel is brass, so on my 750F1 (same lock) I got a drill as close to the diameter of the bit of the barrel that turns (think it was 8 or 9mm, bearing in mind it was 20 odd years ago! :-\) and on a very slow speed, drilled it down till I hit the steel bolt (about 20mm) that is behind the barrel, then put a large screwdriver into the remains of the barrel, and managed to turn it anti clockwise and out it came ;D Hope this helps
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Thanks for that hairygit. I've mailed DSS.
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You will find the answer is no as its a neiman lock and they don't supply blanks or spare keys.
CAREFULLY pull on the disc till the rivet comes out as you will need to re-use it then drill out the brass with a 12mm drill bit till the lock comes out. Keep the spring as the new one don't come with it.
Lock key has to be turned to insert barrel then re-insert rivet and disc
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Tom - sorry to hijack your thread a little...
My 400 is a little 'oddball' in having '77 F2 American frame / engine numbers, which include the swing arm footrests. All the other bits; tank, footpegs, handlebars, lights etc are UK spec. But from this thread I now learn the steering lock may be different - ie mine is operated via the ignition key.
Q. I was considering 'upgrading' my frame to the later UK (E) one with loop pillion footrests - but now ask if in doing so I'll loose the steering head frame configuration and have to revert to a separate lock system? (ie given the choice I'd stick with my ignition operated steering lock, and perhaps save considerable work in the process.)
Cheers & thanks...
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To the best of my knowledge all the UK 400's had the seperate steering lock, but having said that if you check the ignition lock it simply extends a hardened pin to lock against something on the frame so , in theory , should be possible to fit
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Cheers Bryan - will have a look but unsure of how I'd know without having the 2 frames side-by-side to compare. My parts PDF - kindly supplied by Peter (Kent400) - does not clarify. You gotta ask just why Honda would go to the expense / trouble of 2 different locking systems - I originally figured some 'elf'n'safety issue - but cars have long had steering locked by the ignition key.
Thanks again.
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Honda were not always logical mate, theywere still making the 500K1 for the UK when the states had theK2 and the 550
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Cheers all,
The attached (English & American frames) putting pictures into words. My (American) ignition lock has a protruding pin which locks against the upper headstock flange.
Thanks for the various helps,
Lobo
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Thanks to Bryanj and hairygit for their advice above (http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,4947.msg23242.html#msg23242). This is all fixed.
I used a claw hammer to lever out the rivet then a 6mm drill, which takes out the internals only. Once I got to more or less the key depth the lock can be twisted with a screwdriver. Last picture shows the locked position.
Thanks again
Tom
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I had a go at replacing my steering lock last night. I had to as I haven't got any keys for the one on there. It took a while to get the old one out. I started with a 4mm drill before going up to the 6mm. I still couldn't get the centre piece out, or turn it at all. I ended up drilling out the whole center piece with a 9mm drill bit, then using a small Allen key hooked into one of the internal slots, I managed to pull the lock out with mole grips on the Allen key.
Now I'm not used to this type of lock but looking at the design, am I right in thinking the whole lock needs to slide in and out of the housing and the steel bit at the end should locate into a hole in the steering stem? My steering stem doesn't have a hole in it!
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I think you are right Oddjob. I can see down the lock hole well and there is definitely no hole on the stem! This probably explains why The stem isn't long enough to get the washer under the steering stem's top nut :o.
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Hi gents. I have a 1972 500/4 imported from Italy.
It has the yoke in the attached pic which I feel sure is not correct.
I have the correct yoke to replace it with, on which the lock has a plastic cap with a dust cover tab on a sprung shaft like my old UK 72 bike.
Just curious to see if anyone knows what the Neiman one is off, and whether it's of interest.
Regards Jerry
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That's totally different to the 400.
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Maybe a 450 twin, or 350/4?
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There was no difference in the lower yoke no matter what country according to the parts book so must be off another bike but i dont ever remember seeing that type of lock in that position, how about you Oddjob?
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Many thanks for your reply. I see from the exploded parts diagrams the correct 500/4 plastic cap type was common to many like the 450 and 350. Maybe it's off a different make!
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My first 400/4 late 76 'transition' i.e no pinstripe tank etc but pillion rests on frame loops had the Neiman lock and did not use the one on the ignition switch. It was definitely standard as I bought it from a dealer at 6 months old (who part exe'd it for a GT380 ::) ) So I reckon yours is standard. It's not like the CB250/350/early 750K with the plastic cap and metal sprung loaded flap though and uses a separate metal key to the ignition switch with no plastic on it. Probably some security feature for Euro model bikes.
Cheers ...AshD
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Many thanks for your time AshD.
The instruments are 350/4 so I guess these and the yoke may have been a cheap fix after a front end ding, maybe using a 400 yoke.
Either way I think it would be nice to have the normal 1 key setup, and I've got a full lock/ign set coming, then can maybe sell the '400 style' keyless yoke, and the lock from my new old yoke complete with the key I am getting to remove it. (Shame to drill it)
Also have 350/4 tacho and speedo to sell on, plus a spare 500/4 speedo with jammed odometer(looks ok though) plus a spare tacho. (Having bought correct NOS ones as a treat!)
Many thanks for the info, as at least I can offer the yoke to be of use to someone to preserve another classic.
I like the 380 reference. 35 years ago 2 of us had 500's and one had the 380 he though was quicker until a classic moment on Young Street near Box Hill. We still laugh about it!!
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Many thanks Oddjob
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The Neiman steering locks where fitted to the XL500s models, I have a 1980 UK spec model
Alan
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Yes and the 400 but not on the bottom yoke as the picture