Honda-SOHC
General => New Member Introductions => Topic started by: gvhbiker on June 21, 2017, 12:27:18 PM
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Hi.
My name is Geoff & I've been a biker for more years than I care to remember. I ride a modern R1200GS, & also have a 66 Bonneville, a 59 Triumph Speed Twin, a 74 Norton Commando & a 61 Triumph Tiger Cub.
I had a beautiful restored CB750F from about 2001 to 2012 which I sold after I bought a Z900 and it's one of those "wish I'd never sold it" bikes.
As I'm not riding my old bikes enough I'm thinking about selling all of the old Brits except the Bonnie & buying a CB750 K1 I've been offered - and that's where I need advice!
I've yet to see it in the flesh but pictures of the bike look stunning, it has been restored to a very high standard & has won prizes, but whoever restored it apparently didn't stamp the numbers on the new frame & engine casing. It's registered with the DVLA & on the road - so no issues there - the asking price is right for the bike but what about resale potential? If I'm cautious won't a potential buyer years down the line be equally wary? I need to check everything out & see the bike for myself but, assuming it's all legitimate, what are peoples views? Any advice/comments would be appreciated. Thanks.
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Hello Geoff and welcome. I can't help you with your questions, I've owned probably around 50 different bikes in my time but never a CB750 :( well not yet anyway! Hope you get the help you need. Regards, Clunker.
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Hi Ya and welcome to the forum.
Better experts on here than me ,
personally sounds dodgy with no numbers on the frame and engine.
If you want to go for it put some photos up on here just how "correct" is it lots of changes over the
early years, you will get ideas on the value but only after seeing details.
basically is it "correct" or just "pretty" or are you worried about originality?.
Rich
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As I said, not seen it yet, but I'm assuming it's "correct" as I'm told it's won prizes at VJMCC events.
I am bothered about correctness, & will post some pics once I've seen it in the flesh - thanks for your reply.
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Not dodgy if they haven't been welded over or ground off. New spare frames from Honda did not have numbers, the dealer that replaced the frame should have stamped it with the numbers from the frame it replaced (bent or otherwise damaged) The same was true of replacement crankcase sets, and a lot of early 750s needed them due to damage from broken drive chain. I bought a newly frame for £90 from D.S. more then 20 years ago, got it stamped by a dealer for £10. Also bought crankcases, but sold them for 3 times what I paid for them, again no numbers. If you do buy it, you can get them stamped, stops any hassle from plod, and deter thieves!
Sent from my X6pro using Tapatalk
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Not dodgy if they haven't been welded over or ground off. New spare frames from Honda did not have numbers, the dealer that replaced the frame should have stamped it with the numbers from the frame it replaced (bent or otherwise damaged) The same was true of replacement crankcase sets, and a lot of early 750s needed them due to damage from broken drive chain. I bought a newly frame for £90 from D.S. more then 20 years ago, got it stamped by a dealer for £10. Also bought crankcases, but sold them for 3 times what I paid for them, again no numbers. If you do buy it, you can get them stamped, stops any hassle from plod, and deter thieves!
Sent from my X6pro using Tapatalk
Brilliant - thank you, that's really helpful!
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Not dodgy if they haven't been welded over or ground off. New spare frames from Honda did not have numbers, the dealer that replaced the frame should have stamped it with the numbers from the frame it replaced (bent or otherwise damaged) The same was true of replacement crankcase sets, and a lot of early 750s needed them due to damage from broken drive chain. I bought a newly frame for £90 from D.S. more then 20 years ago, got it stamped by a dealer for £10. Also bought crankcases, but sold them for 3 times what I paid for them, again no numbers. If you do buy it, you can get them stamped, stops any hassle from plod, and deter thieves!
Sent from my X6pro using Tapatalk
So did dealers back in the day have the correct Honda stamps to stamp engine and ViN nos as per the factory? The honda font is unique to Honda...
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My local dealer at the time had a set back then, as they repaired/rebuilt a lot of crashed bikes, but that was 20+Years ago, although I doubt they would just throw them away!
Sent from my X6pro using Tapatalk
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Welcome to the forum Geoff. I love your list of Brit Bikes, I would be a very happy bunny having any of them indoors. Just out of interest, how has the K1 been MOT'd in the past with no numbers, is it a UK or USA bike?.
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Welcome ..
I didn't know correct Honda Font stamps were available outside use in the factory but I may be wrong.
I have a CB250K0 frame which is unstamped and I have the V5C for it in my name for it plus a NOS set of blank CB250K0 crankcases, so theoretically, I could build an engine using those cases and put it in the unstamped frame with the V5C and it would be perfectly legitimate. I suppose an MOT man would insist on me stamping at least the frame but they wouldn't be bothered about the font style. However your K1 is always going to be a 'bitsa' and this will reflect in it's value. K1's have risen in value a lot over the past few years but buyers of K0/K1's are often very fussy about matching numbers etc. As a guestimate I would knock 15-20% off the 'normal' matching no's price in similar condition for it and if he wants full value I would walk away. UK vs USA bike prices are also a lot different for 750 K0/K1's ....... UK bikes are rare and command a higher price.
My mate is into collecting Brit bikes and would probably be interested in the Tiger Cub if you are selling it,
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Welcome to the forum Geoff. I love your list of Brit Bikes, I would be a very happy bunny having any of them indoors. Just out of interest, how has the K1 been MOT'd in the past with no numbers, is it a UK or USA bike?.
Hi - thanks.
Its a UK bike. I don't know how it's been MOT'd - I'm speaking to the owner tonight & that's one of my questions but the V5 carries the numbers & if it's anything like my local MOT station it could have been done of the last MOT certificate!!!!
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Welcome ..
I didn't know correct Honda Font stamps were available outside use in the factory but I may be wrong.
I have a CB250K0 frame which is unstamped and I have the V5C for it in my name for it plus a NOS set of blank CB250K0 crankcases, so theoretically, I could build an engine using those cases and put it in the unstamped frame with the V5C and it would be perfectly legitimate. I suppose an MOT man would insist on me stamping at least the frame but they wouldn't be bothered about the font style. However your K1 is always going to be a 'bitsa' and this will reflect in it's value. K1's have risen in value a lot over the past few years but buyers of K0/K1's are often very fussy about matching numbers etc. As a guestimate I would knock 15-20% off the 'normal' matching no's price in similar condition for it and if he wants full value I would walk away. UK vs USA bike prices are also a lot different for 750 K0/K1's ....... UK bikes are rare and command a higher price.
My mate is into collecting Brit bikes and would probably be interested in the Tiger Cub if you are selling it,
Hi. Thanks.
It's a UK bike & the price seems to be about right for the number issue.
Regarding the Cub, I bought it as a project - more a construction kit really, engine has been professionally rebuilt, powder coating & paint done, wheels done, etc. The work done is top quality but the paint job isn't correct for the year - it's been done as a "mini Bonnie" - just as we used to do them back in the day! If it's of interest I can send him some pics.
Cheers
Geoff
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Welcome to the forum Geoff. I love your list of Brit Bikes, I would be a very happy bunny having any of them indoors. Just out of interest, how has the K1 been MOT'd in the past with no numbers, is it a UK or USA bike?.
Hi - thanks.
Its a UK bike. I don't know how it's been MOT'd - I'm speaking to the owner tonight & that's one of my questions but the V5 carries the numbers & if it's anything like my local MOT station it could have been done of the last MOT certificate!!!!
So how would you know the MOT relates to that bike and how would you know if it's a K1 engine in a K1 frame without stripping the engine to see if it has K1 bits in it?
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Welcome to the forum Geoff. I love your list of Brit Bikes, I would be a very happy bunny having any of them indoors. Just out of interest, how has the K1 been MOT'd in the past with no numbers, is it a UK or USA bike?.
Hi - thanks.
Its a UK bike. I don't know how it's been MOT'd - I'm speaking to the owner tonight & that's one of my questions but the V5 carries the numbers & if it's anything like my local MOT station it could have been done of the last MOT certificate!!!!
So how would you know the MOT relates to that bike and how would you know if it's a K1 engine in a K1 frame without stripping the engine to see if it has K1 bits in it?
Very good point!!!!
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On a U.K. bike there should be a makers plate riveted to a front downtube of the frame, the V.J.M.C.C. would have severely criticised if it was missing. When you get to see it in the flesh, the frame number on the plate should match the number on the V5. If it doesn't, then something is very wrong :o
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I bought a replacement C90 frame, didn't have a number on it so I borrowed a set of stamps and did it myself. The vin plate was flat and the result was OK but the normal stamps wouldn't work on a radiussed headstock.
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MOT man is SUPPOSED to look at the stamped number, vin plate is acceptable but stamped in frame is preferred, I didn't think vin plates were fitted to K1.
A re=stamp is obvious even if you do get Honda font stamps (which I have never seen!)
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My MOT chap (bless him) barely looks at the bike never mind the stamping. He always asks for a previous MOT and takes the details off that. Hasn't looked at a frame number on any of my bikes for years. I could weld on the back half of a Triumph and he probably wouldn't notice, just so long as it was shiny. I'm told he goes over them with a fine tooth comb if they look tatty and unmaintained.
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I will be honest and say when i was testing 50% of the pass was who brought it in