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1978 Honda CB550 Supersport - My first retro bike rolling restoration!
woody928:
Well it only seems appropriate to start a proper project thread here following my previous intro a month or so ago. I'm certainly going to have lots of questions for you all as I go!
Last night I went and collected my 1978 Honda CB550 F1 Super Sport (I believe? Please correct me if this is wrong, I'm a total novice). Does anything look non standard or out of place? It looks like the exhaust is a 'Marshall system' which I'm assuming is a relatively period piece?
The bike has sat in storage for a number of years unused and therefore is in need of some serious TLC. It managed the 35 or so mile ride home however it was very clear that it is in need of some servicing and inspection.
The throttle response was erratic at times, on occasion there was almost a total lack of throttle response. The bike wouldn't climb past 70mph on the motorway and I was having to tinker with the fuel adjustor to lower the idle and keep the bike happy. By the time I got it home I noticed that what I'm assuming are the carb overflow pipes were dropping fuel down onto the ground, the exhaust was popping and banging on overrun so I'm assuming is running rich and on inspection one of the HT leads had dropped onto the manifold and nearly melted through.
I'll be honest and say that I've never worked on bikes before, however I'm mechanically minded and have a workshop manual so intend to crack on and learn as I go. I'm hoping to end up with a reliable bike that can be ridden and enjoyed, originality doesn't bother me as I intend to do some brat/cafe style mods to the bike later down the line with a view to improving performance and changing aesthetics however for now I just want to get it running well and see where I stand.
With the above in mind, I'd be grateful of your thoughts on my current 'to do list'
- Change Oil/Oil Filter
- Replace Air Filter
- Fresh Fuel/ Fuel filter?
- Strip down carbs and rebuild?
- Check timing (never done this before so any guidance appreciate however there's the manuals and YouTube)
- Check valve clearances (never done this before so any guidance appreciate however there's the manuals and YouTube)
- Replace HT leads
- Replace Points
- Flush brake hydraulics
- Front brake rebuild, master too?
Anything I should be adding to that list or further input? Can anyone advise where is a good place to be searching for replacement parts in the UK? are there any good websites for basic consumables?
In particular where to get replacement HT leads and rebuild kits would be useful? I also believe I'm correct in saying I need to be very specific about the make and year of the bike as there were lots of revisions and therefore certain parts/kits won't fit?
Anyway, here's some pictures for you all.
Cheers, Mark
72DA583C-121C-4630-8110-816CA766A5AA by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7623 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7618 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7630 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7631 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7654 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7656 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7626 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7651 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
IMG_7657 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr
SPR:
That looks pretty good as it stands now
Maintenance wise I’m sure the experienced mob will be doing to point you in the right direction :)
Look forward to seeing how you progress
Cheers
Simon
Bryanj:
Download the proper Honda manual, you have to start with the 500 and then the 550 "supplements"
Points gap is 0.35mm(14 thou) get feeler gauges with that size in there and spend a lot of time getting the points gap and timing spot on.
DO NOT put a screwdriver in the slot on the end of the camchain tensioner bolt.
If its been stood that long a new drive chain may be a good idea NOT an O ring type.
Rest is easy------honest
woody928:
--- Quote from: SPR on May 20, 2020, 12:20:56 AM ---That looks pretty good as it stands now
Maintenance wise I’m sure the experienced mob will be doing to point you in the right direction :)
Look forward to seeing how you progress
--- End quote ---
Thanks Simon :) It looks pretty complete to me, benefits from a recent respray and seems to be a great starting point.
--- Quote from: Oddjob on May 20, 2020, 03:25:10 AM ---There are a couple of things I can spot that I'd change or correct but as you say originality isn't what your looking for so maybe you'll leave them.
First off yes it's an F1. Green clock faces and flat paint are F1, blue clock faces and metallic paint are F2. The F1 had fork bellows and the F2 didn't.
Your missing the reflectors off the side of the fork ears, saying that your also missing the correct headlight. The shell should be black plastic not chrome and I suspect the OE headlight is bigger as well, should be 7" IIRC. Always better to be seen and be able to see IMO so maybe revert to standard on that one.
The tacho cable appears to be broken, casing has split from the housing near the engine, someone clearly been mucking around in that area as the metal part of the cable shows pliers/grip marks. Be VERY careful removing the cable as it's very easy to break the housing on the engine it locates into, DON'T use an impact driver on the screw holding the cable in place.
There is a thread on site made by Ashimoto on repairing the HT leads on the original coils. Read it and see if you can do it. I've said this before and I'm going to say it again, turn the coils back to front so the HT leads come out of the back, you may need to swap sides on the coils but if your replacing the leads anyway just make them longer and trim down after. Get the leads running over the engine not dangling in the breeze like they are now, saves them shorting out in the rain and also of course getting melted on the exhaust. End cylinders use a long angled HT cap exactly like you got fitted, the inner 2 use a straight long cap.
Should look like this
Flush hydraulics, yes, always a good idea, you've no idea how long it's been in there. Rebuild kit, see how it works first. Remove the caliper and see how the arm it mounts on swings first. Might need some attention as they tend to stick causing brake bind.
Remove rear wheel and check drum lining for cracking, known problem with these bikes. You can get the liner replaced but check first is my advise.
Someone has replaced the left hand switchgear and fitted the wrong one, the UK version has an headlight flasher incorporated into the horn button, yours has the USA version fitted by the look of it, very faded as well so maybe source a new correct version, flasher does come in handy.
Remove the carbs and refurb, use original brass unless damaged. Lots of tips on how to do that on site, just have a good read first.
Change oil and filter, yep, change air filter, check to see how dirty it is first, change points, not unless they are pitted, use original points if possible as aftermarket can cause some timing issues.
Check tappets, yep. Also check camchain tensioner is working. How's the engine sound on tickover? lumpy? a bit noisy like a low down thumping noise?
Lots of advise on here, just heed the experts and you'll soon have her running sweet. Provided of course your prepared to spend a bit of money, parts ain't cheap these days.
Nice example BTW, a very good start by the look of it.
--- End quote ---
Can I just start by saying a huge thank you for the detailed response! ;D
That's great to have it confirmed that it is an F1, it should make parts searches infinitely easier.
Thats really interesting, I'll certainly be adding a 7inch headlight to the list then along with a new modern bulb to hopefully brighten things up. I'll be steering clear of chrome as I must admit on the whole I find it a bit much albeit it can also look fantastic.
I've had a look and the tacho cable behind the tachometer is also covered in electrical tape so I suspect its hiding previous bodges. It does however still work so I'll be leaving it for now while more pressing issues are addressed. Thanks for highlighting, are new replacements obtainable?
I've just had a look into this, on the basis of the work involved and also given the coils are an unknown, I'm tempted to just replace with new items for peace of mind. That's a fantastic idea, no idea why it wasn't done like that before, I'll get those switched around while I'm in there. Definitely seems like a no brainer to reroute them!
Duly noted, I'll take a less invasive route first and see how it stands. It certainly pulled up on the return home however I have no idea how efficient the brakes were assuming they're in good order. I know we're well behind modern counterparts! I'll check out the rear drum too then.
Is the correct UK version still available anywhere? I wouldn't even know what it would look like however I must admit it did look very odd as a pairing, a flasher could come in very handy!
Carbs are going to be my biggest initial challenge I imagine, I've been watching a video of a teardown by classic octane on youtube. I think it will be like my bible through out the process.
Noted on the service items, will proceed as such.
Those are two new skills I'm going to have to read up on and learn. I fired up the bike this evening having stat it since I've been home. Clearly it wasn't getting enough fuel with current settings now that it's cold. Urm it sounds very noisy to me and far from healthy compared to before now however I'll defer to all of your experience and judgement.
https://youtu.be/KYzUYmTbiPk
I've realised that money will need to be spent however I'm keeping my fingers crossed that its far more affordable than my cars have been! I fear theres lots of jobs to do before getting on to fun modifications, the joys of classic motoring!
Thanks again for all of your input, its invaluable! 8)
--- Quote from: Bryanj on May 20, 2020, 07:41:46 AM ---Download the proper Honda manual, you have to start with the 500 and then the 550 "supplements"
Points gap is 0.35mm(14 thou) get feeler gauges with that size in there and spend a lot of time getting the points gap and timing spot on.
DO NOT put a screwdriver in the slot on the end of the camchain tensioner bolt.
If its been stood that long a new drive chain may be a good idea NOT an O ring type.
Rest is easy------honest
--- End quote ---
Thanks Bryan, I've found a few in Aladdins cave and have begun reading thank you, certainly two things I'm going to have to learn to do. I fear that part will be a steep learning curve.
I'll keep this in mind, is there any reason I'd be tempted to do so? (showing total ignorance)
Would you recommend the X type chain instead, it could be a good idea for peace of mind?
Trigger:
--- Quote from: Oddjob on May 21, 2020, 10:34:53 PM ---I have a 500 which has been converted to all the electrics off a CB550F2. The F1 and F2 are virtually identical on electrics. I've just bought a brand new L/H switchgear with passing switch so I'll post a pic of it for you when I can find it again. It may be for sale as I've completely restored my old one and I'm happy to use that for now. Be aware that some parts are cheap and others seem to be vastly inflated, it depends on how many are still sat on shelves I think. If it's very rare be prepared to pay over the odds for the part, petrol tanks NOS are very expensive and a genuine new 550 silencer will set you back and arm and a leg IF you can find one.
The black headlight bowl is readily available but be sure it's off a 550 as the 500 is deeper and won't fit due to the handlebar mounted ignition switch on the 550. The 550 is shallower as the handlebar switch wires go down under the tank and not into the headlight like on the 500. Headlights are easy to find as a rule, try and find a good 7" Cibie if you can as they are really good. I had one around a while ago brand new but no idea where it is now. If I find it I'll let you know.
Tacho cable is easy to find and replace.
Some bad and good reports on the David Silver coil replacements, I prefer to stay standard and it's cheaper to fix the old ones than buy new. The coils are usually fine, it's the leads that fail.
Some controversy now, everyone says DON'T fit an O ring chain on the 500/550 but I ran one for years and it was fine. The problem is that the O ring chain is wider than the standard chain and the link pins gouge into the crankcase where the front sprocket fits. This is true, however it's really only true IMO if you use a 530 O ring chain, the pins are longer. The standard chain supplied from new was a DID 50 chain with split link, this had a pin length of 21.9 according to the DID website, this is 0.8622 inches, (for some reason DID list the existing chain dimensions in inches and the old style chain in MM), a 530 chain has a pin length of 0.963 for an O ring and 0.931 for an X ring chain (O ring and X ring chains are the same except for how the rivet is riveted) so you can see it's much wider, however the 525 O ring chain has a pin length of 0.886 for O ring and 0.866 for X ring, so almost identical to the standard 50 chain. The O ring chain I ran was off a CBX550 which is the same chain as the CB650, the odd thing is if you try and buy an original chain off CMS you can only buy an O ring chain now, funnily enough the same as the CBX550/CB650. Take for that whatever you want, I'll be running an X ring on mine when it's finally restored. Odd but DID list a vintage bike chain in O ring and it's the 525
--- End quote ---
Not all headlight bowls for the 550 are the same. The early 550 K0,K1,K2 are the same as the 500/750.
There is a 500F1/F2 headlight bowl >>> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-CB550-F1-F2-SOHC-Headlight-bowl-61301-375-003B/164134785053?epid=675479719&hash=item263732101d:g:tn0AAOSwOM5edy6A
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