Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 04:13:54 PM

Title: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 04:13:54 PM
More bearing headache. I managed to get one of the 5205hs bearings off easily but the other one has a spacer type thing that closes of the hole where the output sprocket it. because its been exposed and dirty and wont budge. I cant get my bearing puller behind the bearing and I don't want to risk trying to pull the bearing and spacer off by the gear sprocket. Has any had any luck removing it?

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AP1GczNvqrrPqNQ_YUbVmYgZSRC_3jcPKzmM0LVGyLlNBr2Q8E7Ue0o9hbhgloICQwc-Y9b5WwOkM1I4xnUzEaygyQuBO93fUYj49eiZrp_F9OeWQWfhYWTsJ65rV78_nIDrdBgolrn8FdVvrptW_2lTAnMZwU9ILm5OWNDpxVh9K01kDDAAe5v6OejIETQpx258gX6D00sVFuj0VVpWmaTwffPGnJG2KkQI5Z8MHJoYgSBnuRjP2rB72yGwzhUMXUXyAXkpgfr8_V9q3g1jzzZjExZMCCyZFSzsFVWqIHuUT_Cp9f22_qSOBmf4bnvpI1xz6vBpKZcRnHRUihVWgUoZPaKf5wKM89-NUn0DrTKG7GuKQ9-aX1xEFWl-ww1U1s8mD9U9Ld1Y2sPsldIycBsOrKBTEFEzwpV7HD4YjTuXfxKyfKPvxfF1f_MSDbie1dkavLqFpuv8wMbwbDcyMBo7LHi_M8ZEQLBZ2p5XRc6lp7D3xeWKfVixqbQfjs-5Ac_0atHSQ0hjwO_COBjZ1t7JlaCjHyGOn3MRTlXA2xqlLibmCy9ukq0L3HpcAmU1Dt6wO_7ipL2PL0SfMXVXMeNDLx8jP_hD1QXvBaLOFEG1c1PFEZnDMa94GbiPNOAiQYsRZ9WIoFBETTkJAEeJY5wAahFj8NIiYg-cA1yZmTGlniFQhlaaSFjPRt9SD1_IFX5t442CL_hPxMrTqg2wqn23f8bn_wku0tmWpp_of8uDh2aKx53ikfISgCg7jfraeGUVcEM-lqiHbOqU8rXOkzA2hSy-y3ZHgswmvKmi2CA5kctH2HNjYviLPZrTVRuN8_YKL-Ycd1WKLI6yyoyq-WpU3_XC7NVm-NDKXENxTMUrGyVU6X_fk1txz-XDTJgP7zoNPUxljydhmXaEbAJKS9L_7V0fiVVNZIvH4NlxCdR3EzXtJbSpYYonzjbBoA7QZJAWsAa3FQfFYWpvgGLvR72cBGEUY41cR8H3=w1699-h1279-s-no-gm?authuser=0)
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Laverda Dave on May 26, 2024, 05:15:24 PM
I would be tempted to get some local heat onto the spacer (not the shaft itself) followed by some gentle taps with a suitable thin and flat wooden wedge GENTLY inserted between the spacer and the bearing going slowly all the way round, these things usually let go with heat and gentle persuasion. If the wooden wedge doesn’t work get that old flat blade screwdriver out that you use to stir paint with! Good Luck.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Laverdaroo on May 26, 2024, 05:36:50 PM
Quote from: Laverdaroo on May 26, 2024, 05:30:52 PM
How to remove the output bearing.

Remove the gear next to to bearing, fit the shaft loosely in a vice so not to mark it and allow it to move and knock the bearing off the shaft so that it moves away from the collar, once it moves a little it will come off easily. Protect the end of the shaft when hitting it. Once off there is a really thin oring fitted between the bearing and the collar, on no account try to remove the collar unless it’s ruined. Do not under any circumstances insert anything between the bearing and the collar.

From a trusted source


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on May 26, 2024, 06:29:23 PM
Iirc there is an O ring between that collar and the gears so heat would ruin that.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 06:34:50 PM

Quote from: Laverdaroo on May 26, 2024, 05:30:52 PM
How to remove the output bearing.

Remove the gear next to to bearing, fit the shaft loosely in a vice so not to mark it and allow it to move and knock the bearing off the shaft so that it moves away from the collar, once it moves a little it will come off easily. Protect the end of the shaft when hitting it. Once off there is a really thin oring fitted between the bearing and the collar, on no account try to remove the collar unless it’s ruined. Do not under any circumstances insert anything between the bearing and the collar.

From a trusted source


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I've added the picture, it didn't work at first.

I don't think the bearing first over the collar? The collar seems to be bigger than the bearing.

Its the collar that I cant seem to remove. I've not tried heating it up yet, I'm going to try later.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on May 26, 2024, 06:39:58 PM
If you mean the part of the shaft where the oil seal sits I'm pretty sure the bearing will come off - just dont heat it and destroy the O ring.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 06:44:22 PM
Quote from: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on May 26, 2024, 06:39:58 PM
If you mean the part of the shaft where the oil seal sits I'm pretty sure the bearing will come off - just dont heat it and destroy the O ring.

Ill have to dig my vice out from the garage. I didn't think of clamping the bearing. I didn't want to damage it too much but I think that's the only way.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on May 26, 2024, 06:48:58 PM
Might be worth a PM to Laverda Dave he did a 400 gearbox rebuild earlier this year.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 07:13:49 PM
The shop manual doesnt show a seal between the collar and bearing/bearing and sprocket.

(https://i.imgur.com/WuCof9y.png)
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 07:56:31 PM
I've tried heating the collar, clamping the bearing and giving the shaft a wack. Not budging at all.

There does seem to be a seal between the bearing and collar. There is no way to remove the gear, the groves are too big for it to slide off the other way, the bearing and collar are holding it on.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Laverda Dave on May 26, 2024, 08:11:46 PM
A stupid question but is the roller bearing damaged and worn? The gearbox on Ratty had over 45k on it (probably over 50k as the PO had fitted a mini Speedo on the bike at some point). When I checked the roller bearings they were fine, no play, no nasty rumbling and no tight spots. The rest of the engine was in a terrible condition as a result of the PO blasting it with a sand gun. The roller bearing was good to go again but unfortunately the shaft was worn beyond repair and I purchased the two gear shafts from Ted. I have no idea how many miles were on that gearbox but again the roller bearings were absolutely fine.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Dolomite_ on May 26, 2024, 08:16:22 PM
Quote from: Laverda Dave on May 26, 2024, 08:11:46 PM
A stupid question but is the roller bearing damaged and worn? The gearbox on Ratty had over 45k on it (probably over 50k as the PO had fitted a mini Speedo on the bike at some point). When I checked the roller bearings they were fine, no play, no nasty rumbling and no tight spots. The rest of the engine was in a terrible condition as a result of the PO blasting it with a sand gun. The roller bearing was good to go again but unfortunately the shaft was worn beyond repair and I purchased the two gear shafts from Ted. I have no idea how many miles were on that gearbox but again the roller bearings were absolutely fine.

The bearing doesn't feel great, quite gritty when spinning it.
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: Bryanj on May 26, 2024, 08:26:27 PM
That collar and bearing usually need a hydraulic press to remove and from memory there is a small cross section O ring between collar and bearing but its not shown in any books. Honda use to recommend changing shaft with bearing and the cost extra used to be negligable
Title: Re: Transmission output shaft bearing removal
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on May 27, 2024, 09:31:37 AM
Quote from: Dolomite_

The bearing doesn't feel great, quite gritty when spinning it.
[/quote

It does not take much dirt in a dry bearing for it to feel gritty. I would be looking at more cleaning to ensure any carbon deposits are not the cause. As the bearings have a good wear life I suspect the death knell is corrosion caused by standing for a long time.