Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB500/550 => Topic started by: DomP on June 21, 2024, 07:23:11 PM

Title: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: DomP on June 21, 2024, 07:23:11 PM
I've mentioned this before but not found out what causes it, every now and then when I turn the ignition on then off I get an airy pop type noise from around the seat/air filter area.  Any idea what's causing it?
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: taysidedragon on June 22, 2024, 12:29:54 AM
It could be some kind of spit back through the carbs and air filter. Usually caused by timing or fuelling being a bit out. Another cause of the sound could be air leaks around the intake manifolds?
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: Athame57 on June 22, 2024, 01:41:29 AM
I've had that myself, also when I turn the fuel tap back on. Maybe the bike has farted? ;D
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: DomP on June 22, 2024, 04:40:41 AM
That's kind of what it sounds like😄
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on June 22, 2024, 08:56:35 AM
Could it be that turning the ignition on then off causes a spark that ignited any fuel vapour in the cylinder head?

 I would expect this to reduce to zero with repeated on/ off as the petrol vapour is burnt off.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: DomP on June 22, 2024, 09:52:02 AM
That does sound like what it could be, is it normal or suggest anything Ted?
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on June 22, 2024, 10:24:31 AM
That does sound like what it could be, is it normal or suggest anything Ted?

I have only encounted this type of noise decades ago on a highy tuned A series engine that had a racing camshaft fitted with intake trumpets.
As has been mentioned is the timing correct likewise is it idling smoothly on balanced carbs?

Is the air intake system/filter  suitably enclosed to surpress what might be a normal occurrence?

Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: DomP on June 22, 2024, 10:37:15 AM
There's definitely a few of those questions I've not addressed yet Ted, timing I believe was spot on when I refitted the Dyna s ignition.   As for balancing and air filter cover, they are a work in progress
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: K2-K6 on June 22, 2024, 10:51:58 AM
There's definitely a few of those questions I've not addressed yet Ted, timing I believe was spot on when I refitted the Dyna s ignition.   As for balancing and air filter cover, they are a work in progress

Thats potentially the origin of it. Some system routinely discharge on shutdown which can fire anything fuel vapour-eee thats laying around in air intakes.

Likely that one of the cylinders has stopped with intake valve open to facilitate a route to vapours from one of the plugs.

A friends Ducati 916 routinely does the same.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: taysidedragon on June 22, 2024, 01:15:33 PM
I've just realised that you get this without running the engine. 🙄 I was tired!
I would look at the starter solenoid. It's in the area you hear the sound and is powered on and off by the ignition.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: deltarider on June 22, 2024, 02:47:32 PM
The starter solenoid was also my guess.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: K2-K6 on June 22, 2024, 06:24:17 PM
Solenoid doesn't switch with ignition at all.

Only active to pull load across the two large terminal when you "call" it with starter button. Not used otherwise.

In any, most, start system, those two high load terminal remain live irrespective of ignition key, being direct from battery positive and not through additional loom routing.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: K2-K6 on June 22, 2024, 06:28:39 PM
To test for OP, you can first switch the engine cut out to OFF as that interupts the coils, then turn the key first on then off to see if it still has symptom.

Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: Laverda Dave on June 22, 2024, 06:34:35 PM
I've had similar symptoms with the Triton. Turn the key to off and it would pop back through the carbs. Having bell mouths on the carbs meant I could actually see it spit back through them. It is definitely the ignition timing causing the problem and despite setting the timing as per the manual it is not correct. The reason is probably as a result of the high compression, change of combustion shape etc.
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: deltarider on June 22, 2024, 08:12:26 PM
Solenoid doesn't switch with ignition at all.
Must be the regulator then I hear, when I switch the key ON or OFF.
I seem to remeber I have read somewhere on the international forum Dyna ignitions can cause this popping, but for what reason?
Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: K2-K6 on June 22, 2024, 08:54:01 PM
Speculative, without circuit design details, but experience from other unrelated electronics;- they'd have to decide on a resting state to leave the earth switching transistors that trigger the coils to fire, which could be either way, connected or not when the control power input is quenched.

Logically, if they removed the earth path on power down it would discharge the coils, only to pick it up from zero when it's switched back on.

Appears like a safer option to start the control,electronics without any residual power anywhere to interfere with initial logic or component lifing.

So turning them of would charge both coils (on these four cylinder) without the crank spinning,  only to then discharge on shutdown with nothing being used in between.

Title: Re: Noise when turning ignition off
Post by: DomP on June 22, 2024, 08:59:19 PM
I'm afraid I can't add much to this except for what I have observed,  it certainly makes me jump sometimes though