Honda-SOHC
SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB500/550 => Topic started by: StPeter on July 03, 2012, 08:30:34 PM
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That made you look . . .
In the olden days - I'm talking of the 70s - the cheese-head casing screws (so called because the heads were made of cheese) would be regularly replaced with hex screws. Usually having drilled the head off and mole-wrenched the remnant of stud out
Eminently sensible from an engineering point of view but is it considered a bit "nouveau" for a restoration? Obviously it's never going to win a concours but I'm aiming for "neat, tidy, shiny and ridden".
What's the general view on them?
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It makes working on the bike easier, and a lot of bikes were fitted with allen bolts early on in life by owners p**sed off with the awful originals >:( See it as a period modification, like aftermarket shocks and exhausts, it's your bike, and I would not hesitate to change them, my 400/4 was only 3 months old when I fitted some! ;D
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One of the first tings I did was replace with allens. They look nice and are a blessing compared to the original screws.
I want my bike to be as maintenance free as possible so I don't mind replacing with more modern/superior parts, within reason of course.
I wouldn't replace anything major that would affect the overall appearance of the bike.
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Thanks, guys. "period modification" - I like that.
World of Hex, here I come!
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All my old 500s have them and they are a PITA to keep clean and shiny.
Take a look at what modern bike manufacturers use - my Tiger uses 8mm hex bolts.
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Back in the olden days replacing the philips screws was the first job that I did on my new 750, my much restored one is the same, so much easier to work with.
Cheers
Den
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...every single bolt and screw was replaced with stainless when I was restoring the bike the first time
Any issues with contact corrosion there?
From my instinct I'd treat the threads with a thin layer of AntiSeize or at leas a gentle smear of copper paste?
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I always use copper based grease or anti seize where steel/aluminium contact takes place, or in hard to get at places such as the centre stand bolts.
Cheers
Den
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All my old 500s have them and they are a PITA to keep clean and shiny.
Take a look at what modern bike manufacturers use - my Tiger uses 8mm hex bolts.
I suspect the bolt choice on our Tigers would be governed by cost (a hex head must be cheaper to make than a cap screw)
Thanks for the other input. Coppaslip is never far away in my garage.
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As a Mech Fitter we're not allowed to use copperslip (coppaslip) on ali on site, its 'sposed to cause electrolitic corrosion ::) We're told its the copper doing the corroding, not the screws.
I've had it on all my stainless steel capscrews on my bikes for years without any threads corroding away though ;D
We are supplied with another antiseize paste (who's trade name escapes me)
once when I had the long lower rear engine bolt made specially, it seemed to bond with the stainless nut and it stuck so hard I broke the bolt trying to remove the nut.
Galling Clicky (http://www.estainlesssteel.com/gallingofstainless.html) (or gauling depending on how you want to spell it ;))
If using stainless nuts and bolts, use A2 bolts with A4 nuts to prevent galling. Oh and copperslip!
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Interesting link, Tomb. I'll make sure to tighten mine up slow and slippery.
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Just read my post again and its a big vague, sorry ::)
Its ALUMINIUM we're not allowed to use copperslip on as its 'sposed to cause corrosion of the aluminium, though I've never had any problems in 30+ years of using it on aluminium :o
Everything else we are 'sposed to use copperslip with, and all our torque settings are calculated using it, and the settings are that accurate they have slightly different settings for different manufacturers of copperslip (coppaslip)
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That's how I read it anyway but nothing wrong with precision!
Dissimilar metals in the presence of electrolyte (something damp and conductive) will set up an electrolytic reaction. Theoretically I can se that coppaslip should be conductive. In a marine or other sever environment this could be an issue but what we're doing here is to pack the threads with something which excludes moisture. Horses for courses - if it was part of a cooling system for a nuclear power plant, I'd use the pukka stuff. On a bike crank case, I'm happy with your and my experience!
As to the different torque settings, wow! I guess that's aerospace work? I bet your torque wrench doesn't hang on a nail on the wall or rattle around in your tool box!
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It wouldn't fit in a toolbox, but is kept spotless and calibrated annually ;D ;D ;D Annoyingly its scaled way above any settings on the bikes so not worth "borrowing" at home ::)
I work on a well known global company site that will remain unnamed by me for career shortening reasons :-X
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and the settings are that accurate they have slightly different settings for different manufacturers of copperslip (coppaslip)
Whilst having like 3 torque wrenches around (from 1.0Nm upward, plus some torque-screwdrivers...), I'm not that 'scientific'.
With a slight smear (not soaked!) on the threads I guesstimate -5% on the given settings in the w/shop manual; didn't snap one yet... ;)
Dunno if allen-bolts really provide 'authentic look', think I'll use them only where its technically required (like deeply hidden, to be reached by ball-headed wrench).
And compared to polished aluminum or chrome, stainless steel always appears a tad too 'yellowish'...