All about candy

[Menno]

All about candy:

Lots of motorbikes and also mopeds from the sixties and seventies are painted in colours called candy. It seemed to me a nice idea to explain what this type of paint is about. This is based upon my own experiences. It is very well possible that there are other opinions.


What is candy?

A candy paint is a see through paint. Like ink sprayed over a base layer. This layer is mostly a metallic layer. The particles of the metallic are sometimes larger and are called flakes. The colour of the paint is a combination of the base coat and over it the candy (ink) paint. When you want to work with flakes you will probably always need a candy paint.

An example of how candy works is for instance a colour you might know from the Honda cb 350 four. The name of the colour is candy bacchus olive and it is a combination of a green metallic base coat over a yellow candy coat with a little bit of orange in it. By spraying this yellow-orange candy coat over the metallic base green you get a colour which can only be obtained in this manor. An even more interesting example is a colour you might know from the cb 500. This is a base blue with over it a see through yellow. Both of them combined makes candy jade green. It cannot be painted with a single ready to use finish coat.


What makes spray painting candy different?

The strange thing about candy is that the end result can be reached in many different ways. And while there are so many possibilities there are even more ways to get it wrong.
I'll try to explain. Think about candy ruby red for example. A colour often seen on a Honda cb 750 but also on a Honda Dax. If you would like to replicate that colour on paper using a pencil you could do that this way: you could take a pencil with a colour that resembles this red the most and start colouring. But; how will you do this? Will you try to fill a square by pushing as hard as you possibly can on the pencil and in this way try to get as much colour on the paper as possible in one layer? The result might be a very bright red but it takes a lot of effort applying the colour even. At some points you might get a double layer which results in a darker area. An on other parts you might have added to few of the colour so the white of the paper might shine through. An other possibility is by starting to fill up a square with no pressure on the pencil at all. With lots of patience you could put layer over layer over layer until you get the desired colour. But when is that exactly? Maybe with the final layer you are already making the colour to dark.

It isn't a big deal if  you are trying to get three squares an equal colour at the same time. It is more difficult when you already have an example which you want to copy. Which technique did they use? With force or gently? Or maybe one of the thousand other possibilities in between. Getting the same result isn't suddenly that easy anymore.

That is the reason I always advise to have a tank and side panels painted together.
There is more. Paint from the 70's has a tendency to fade a lot. Especially in the sun. It is almost impossible to paint a fading colour.

What makes painting candy so difficult?

First of all getting the right colour is not easy. Just like the example with the pencil you have to determine whether  you can paint the paint in one layer or if you need multiple layers. Most of the time you need multiple layers since one layer doesn't give enough colour. And when you spray the paint to thick the paint starts running.
Secondly you need to have the right overlap between the lines you paint. With a normal paint it doesn't matter if you paint the same spot twice or even four times, the colour will remain the same. If you do the same with candy the more paint you spray on one spot the darker the spot will become. It is not always easy to paint an even layer. A paint pistol sprays more paint in the centre and the paint becomes less towards the outside. With a normal paint getting an even layer is not that difficult. If the paint in the centre is thicker and you spray in lines one wouldn't notice this. And it doesn't matter actually, as long as the paint covers the tank you're ok. With candy the colour can easily  become cloudy in stead of an even layer.

Third is the amount of layers. The more layers you paint the darker the colour gets.
A painter can play with the darkness of the layers by adjusting his spray gun, air, choice of nozzle, pressure and so on.

Every adjustment can have an effect on the colour.  You need practise, experience and...
fingerspitzengefühl – instinctive feeling.

Most important however:

it is almost impossible to correct candy.
With a plain colour you can polish the paint away. For instance when the paint started running. With metallic you can sand up the area and do a spot repair. With candy this doesn't work because the surrounding area would become lighter when polishing and darker with a repaint.

And that is the reason why candy is not repairable.

When you have a scratch in for instance your candy gold tank and the scratch goes all the way to the bare metal how can you repair this? First you need to get the base paint exactly in the scratch without getting it on the surrounding areas. Than you need to apply just the right amount of candy to the spot to go over the base layer. Without going over the surrounding candy. It is almost impossible to do that.

And then: everything has worked out fine. You have a lovely nice tank set in candy. Then you need to apply the lines and maybe black areas. It is always a sorry sight when those lines are crooked or out of alignment.


Stickers:

Stickers are difficult as well. Stickers are most of the time very expensive and to old. A sticker has an expiring date.
Dealers often buy a bunch of stickers and have them lying on a shelve until someone comes along to buy them. Most of the time stickers become unusable after six months.
The problem with old stickers is either the sticker doesn't stick very well anymore. Lots of air bubbles you cannot get rid of. Or (happens more often) the sticker sticks to well. Even with the use of water and a drop of soap the sticker sticks immediately to the surface. And always with a wrinkle in the middle. And when trying to correct it might just happen a part of your freshly painted surface comes off as well. (Been there, done that).
And even if everything gets on fine you still have to do the other side. Some guy named Murphy is always there to help you...

New stickers are easier but there is still a lot of room for error.

Be aware that most stickers sold are sold because there is a demand. Not because the sellers work with those stickers. Quality is often poor. Some stickers simply don't stick, or are not really paint resistant. Lots of stickers are to thick. And than you need to apply more than six layers of clear to cover them. But often the sticker can't handle so much paint and starts to curl.

Going back to the store results most of the time in it being your fault. You used to much water or to much soap or not enough of both. Even if you get a new set of stickers they still need to be put on.

This is one of the reasons I spray paint most of the lines. It is a lot of work but stays on for ever.
And saves me a lot of frustration.

Buy stickers when you need them. Not to have them in stock. Ask how old the stickers are when buying them.

One needs to have lots of passion to paint tanks and panels in candy. Maybe be a bit crazy even. A car is mostly easier to repaint or repair and pays much more. (Mostly insurance work).
But doing what you like is worth a lot I guess.

[RGP750]

Hi Menno
Thanks for that incite into the candy paint world.
I agree far better to go to work doing a job you enjoy.
Can't wait to see my 175 parts (i'm not chasing)
Rich

[AshimotoK0]

Brilliant Menno .. that was a fascinating read and insight into your 'art'.

For anyone who hasn't used Menno his paint is superb. The guy I also use in the UK's paint is superb too BUT Menno's magic continues inside of the tank as he gets the inside squeaky clean by some magic process. Is that treatment a 'trade secret' Menno or can you share those details too?

I wonder how the car guys will cope with all of the candy looking (or is it pearl) finishes coming out in recent years, for example, Mazda and Renault. I would have thought respraying a large accident damaged panel would be really difficult to achieve a uniform finish without creating any 'striping'. Guess they are just going to have to 'up their game', as in the showroom, a customer is going to choose the candy painted option over the normal flat or straight metallic colours all day long and I bet other manufacturers will follow (They probably have already as I am not up on modern cars).

[Trigger]

The OEM stickers were thick on the tanks in the first place. I have a few original tanks and you can feel the sticker under the lacquer.

[Piki]

Very good post, thank you.

[UK Pete]

Most excellent write up menno
Pete

[MeilakJ]

Really Interesting Menno .

Thanks for the information.

[Menno]

Thanks guys.

@Rich: almost there. I'll get back to you this week.

@Oddjob: it is not the lack of air that prevents a sticker from aging or sunlight for that matter. It is the chemicals that make up the glue which makes the sticker stick.
Most of the glues you have in the house will get old after a while even without sunlight or air. But the best comparison is maybe a roll of scotch tape. When it gets old it sticks much better - sometimes even to well. 

@Ashimoto: cleaning the inside of your tank is easily done with cleaning vinigar. Costs almost nothing and works like a charm. I go to this special firm near to me. It is not a secret, here is their website: http://www.entlackungszentrum-zweibruecken.de/oldtimer.htm
The reason I go there is because the cleaning of the outside of the tank is cheaper than for instance sandblasting. And since they throw the tank in a bath a free bonus is a clean inside as well.

[Menno]

@ Trigger: you are right. But with thick I really mean: thick. I mean 6 layers of clear before covering the sticker - thick.

[Chris400F]

Menno, that is really good information even for those of us that don't need any paintwork doing.
I understand what you say about decals, and why you choose to paint stripes etc instead.
What intrigues me is how you go about masking up the tank or panel for a given paint scheme.
Do you have a set of templates and/or measurements for different makes and models, or is it a case of using whatever the visual equivalent of fingerspitzengefühl is?

[Menno]

Hi Chris, sorry about this late answer.

Mostly I copy original lines and stickers on a special plastick layer.
This , i cut out and use as a pattern on the tank I want to paint.
On this template I've written the mesurements on how to place the template on the tank.
After copying the lines with an erasable marker i start working with special masking tape.

Some paintschemes I mask from free hand.

I do not always need a template sometimes a picture is sufficient enough.

Most Importand however;

If you have a tank you want to paint, and it has still it's original lining don't sand it off!
It doesn't matter how damaged it is I might still be able to use the mesurements from the lining.

[Woodside]

Hi menno
I have a fantic tx7 little mini bike here I'm just about to have the seat retrimmed. ..
But I'm going to loose the "fantic moto" from the rear..
Would you be able to make me another stencil from pictures and measurements. .. or would you need the old rear patch which luckily I still have

[Woodside]

Sorry just seen that was probably a question for piki...
But I do need the paint done and would want the tank sign written again
Should end up looking somthing like this

[Menno]

I think with lettering you are better served with a sticker so maybe Piki can make a scan of it and duplicate it(?)
If I have the tank and the sticker I can use the tank to write down the exact position of the sticker before I have the tank chemicaly cleaned.

Just a suggestion.

[Woodside]

Ok ill pm piki..about tank and seat
Will let you know
Thanks