1967 CB450K0 Black Bomber Rebuild - By Royhall

[royhall]

Wondering if there are any close that could be machined as the basic design has mostly been copied from those early Honda I believe.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Anlasser-freilauf-Starter-CLUTCH-Yamaha-VMAX-1200-V-MAX-Kupplung-VMAX12-/111619692053

Is it the component in above link?

Yes it is similar and the same overall design, but check my update above.

[K2-K6]

Ah, that could be a problem 

[AshimotoK0]

looks like all of your lugs have been snapped off Roy .. it should have them as in the CMS image.

Used ones do pop up on eBay and surprisingly are mega expensive in the States but often quite reasonabe in the UK. This one from DK (sadly sold but given as an example) was quite cheap and looked decent.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-CB450K-CB450-K-1968-1974-Generator-Rotor-Starter-Clutch-Chain/333732250254?hash=item4db3fe028e:g:tvEAAOSwAhtfbL9t

[K2-K6]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HONDA-68-71-CB450-68-74-CL450-MAGNETO-ROTOR-FLYWHEEL-2-/371982967963

This one "appears" to be available.

[K2-K6]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/68-74-Honda-CB450-CL450-Super-Sport-Scrambler-CL-CB-450-Flywheel-Rotor-/373352162152

Same seller but wildly different postage costs!

[K2-K6]

https://www.kdnoorse.com/early-6568-honda-cb450-cb-450-super-sport-nos-outer-starter-clutch-housing-unit-p-516092.htm

This is showing,  but I don't understand buying process as pictures seem to be advertised elsewhere.  Whether it's an aggregated site I'm not sure.

[AshimotoK0]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/68-74-Honda-CB450-CL450-Super-Sport-Scrambler-CL-CB-450-Flywheel-Rotor-/373352162152

Same seller but wildly different postage costs!

Like I  said Nigel .... the Americans seem to think they are selling the Crown Jewels when it comes to those parts.

This sold earlier this year and on par with the DK one that sold recently. They also sold another about the same time and both sets looked in pretty decent nick to me.

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[royhall]

https://www.kdnoorse.com/early-6568-honda-cb450-cb-450-super-sport-nos-outer-starter-clutch-housing-unit-p-516092.htm

This is showing,  but I don't understand buying process as pictures seem to be advertised elsewhere.  Whether it's an aggregated site I'm not sure.

Think I may have jumped too soon on this as the site now appears to be a scam. Looks like I'm cancelling a credit card now.

UPDATE. Just spoke to Natwest and this is a scam site based in HongKong. Credit card cancelled and payment stopped. I suckered myself into that, if it looks too good to be true it usually is a scam. First time in my life I have fallen for that. At least nothings lost. The site is KDNOORSE.COM please beware.

[Bryanj]

Never done a 450 but the 500T was also notorious for destroying the starter clutch and loosening the clutch on the rotor.
Have no experience of this but the 500 is so similar could it be modified---'if you can find a good one!!

[AshimotoK0]

Never done a 450 but the 500T was also notorious for destroying the starter clutch and loosening the clutch on the rotor.
Have no experience of this but the 500 is so similar could it be modified---'if you can find a good one!!

The 500T alternator rotor is slightly different Bryan and I think the sprocket hub has a bearing in it. I do have a NOS 500T rotor I got for mine and I am long overdue to measure it up and compare with a Bomber one so I will do that over the next couple of days. You are dead right, you see 450's for sale, top dollar but often it's stated that the electric starter doesn't work.

I personally would wait until the likes of DK or BGM get another one in and buy the whole assembly. I have dealt with both and they take returns if you are not happy with no quibbling. Seems they sell them complete for less than a hundred quid, whilst the Amercans can often ask 200 quid just for one component that's not even NOS .

Update: here is the 500T Parts Book ... the sprocket hub does have a needle roller bearing in it but the bearing is  not listed as a separate part. The other starter clutch parts are a mixture of 283 (K0) ,292 (K1)  & 375 (500T) parts.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fvanpeucgqkrt9e/Honda%20CB500%20Twin%20CB%20500%20T%20Illustrated%20Parts%20List%20Diagram%20Manual.pdf?dl=0

[AshimotoK0]

If you look through the posts in the link below Nigel Harris (who is a member on here I believe) successfully fitted a K5 starter clutch to his K0 Bomber. Still unsure about 500T parts though and I think the very early K0's had a dfferent diameter drive hub on the sprocket.
UPDATE: Only engines up to  1191 had the smaller diameter sprocket hub fitted.

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https://www.hondatwins.net/threads/later-model-cb450-rotor-starter-clutch-work-on-a-k0-bb.5884/

[K2-K6]

https://www.kdnoorse.com/early-6568-honda-cb450-cb-450-super-sport-nos-outer-starter-clutch-housing-unit-p-516092.htm

This is showing,  but I don't understand buying process as pictures seem to be advertised elsewhere.  Whether it's an aggregated site I'm not sure.

Think I may have jumped too soon on this as the site now appears to be a scam. Looks like I'm cancelling a credit card now.

UPDATE. Just spoke to Natwest and this is a scam site based in HongKong. Credit card cancelled and payment stopped. I suckered myself into that, if it looks too good to be true it usually is a scam. First time in my life I have fallen for that. At least nothings lost. The site is KDNOORSE.COM please beware.

Apologies Roy, I obviously didn't mean to put something up here that could do that. 

There's clearly some aggregator sites that trawl other adds (presume they take a % from the original add service) like picklic does.  We buy through that route,  but I couldn't see the method on that as posted.

[royhall]

Not a problem, I suckered myself into that one. First time that's ever happened to me as I'm usually paranoid about cyber security. We live and learn, just wish those slime-balls would pack it in and get a job.

Reading the above, I may have an early rotor that someone has bodged a later clutch onto. The lugs are not broken they have been filed away. Will give DK a ring tomorrow, what's the best number to get them on.

If I get totally stuck I can always throw £193 through the pirates window and get one of the 3 new ones he has in stock. Ash, is yours a later clutch mechanism, if so can you measure the outside diameter please.

[AshimotoK0]

Here you go Roy Comparison of NOS 500T rotor with used 450K0 bomber rotor

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[royhall]

Thanks for that Ash. The plot just thickened a bit read below.



CB450 K4 vs K5 alternator rotor swap- beware!


The K5 engine I had on my CB500T framed cafe racer-ish fun bike was having transmission woes, and finally crapped the bed when 4th gear on the countershaft lost a chunk. I sourced a 71 CL450 engine that looks beautiful for it’s age, but has no history whatsoever. All I know is it came from a defunct dealership in Nebraska, and was on the original frame, albeit sporting a knobby rear tire and a bunch of mud caked into every depression.
As I’m going over the engine, I discover the alternator rotor is missing altogether, but the stator is still in place. No problem, I’ll just chuck the K5 magneto in there and send it. I set the valve clearances by the timing marks on the rotor, seal it up, slap it in the frame, and start kicking (I delete the starters on these so I can use a tiny battery- plus kickstarting is straight gangster). It’s popping some and has compression and clean carbs, so why the hell is it spitting the gas back through the carbs and not running?
Long story truncated, I end up taking the head off to check the valves and seats (which are fine), and find that the left cylinder at TDC puts the timing mark on the rotor about 20° PAST the index mark for timing. For some reason I cannot fathom, the magneto rotors between 71 and 72 models are keyed differently. The keyway is the exact same size on the tapered crankshaft extension, so it fits right on, it just doesn’t line up.
Further research showed that they’re vastly different rotors in terms of the starter gearing on the backside as well.
This information will probably be of no use to anyone ever, but if it saves one person the hassle of cutting the cam chain and removing the head, or just junking a perfectly good motor out of ignorance, it’s been worth my time to type it out. My searches post-op have revealed no hits regarding this, so it should be out there in the world.