coils and electronic ignition

[Myford]

hi all,
has anyone had experience of using any of the many (new) coils advertised on EBay.
Also what's your experience of electronic ignition (reliability) and what choices are there.
Thanks
Terry

[mike the bike]

I went for the Dyna coils and electronic ignition.  The coils were unreliable in the wet and needed replacing anyway.
I went for the Dyna ignition because there's no extra electronic box to position somewhere - as with most systems. 
The coils are energised by the senders on the points plate.  The only mod I had to do was to supply a 12V feed to the points plate, which is easy enough as 12V goes to the coils from the kill switch anyway.
It's made quite a difference in performance, mainly going uphill, where it used to misfire, and it's also easier to start,

[Johnwebley]

I used the coils from DSS,and they work really well with Boyer ignition,

[Myford]

Thanks guys, I'm surprised just how few electronic ignitions are available for the 400.
I had a look at the Dyna, but I'm not sure I see the point of retaining the mechanical advance and retard. In my view one of the advantages of  a lot of the more modern  EI's is an improved / more stable idle- if it see's the revs slow up it alters the advance slightly to pick the revs up.
Cheers
Terry

[Lobo]

Hi Terry,

If you've the patience of Jobe a past thread here...  I fitted DSS aftermarket coils + a Newtronic H04 (light triggered) to my CB750 and other than fantastic starting can honestly see a difference.

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,7669.msg47905.html#msg47905

Anyways, I'm  interested... which system have you found that does away with both the mechanical 'breakers AND the mechanical Advance / Retard unit?

Simon.

[Johnwebley]

Hi Terry,

If you've the patience of Jobe a past thread here...  I fitted DSS aftermarket coils + a Newtronic H04 (light triggered) to my CB750 and other than fantastic starting can honestly see a difference.

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,7669.msg47905.html#msg47905

Anyways, I'm  interested... which system have you found that does away with both the mechanical 'breakers AND the mechanical Advance / Retard unit?


  the Boyer does that,

Simon.

[JamesH]

I've had good experiences with the Pamco setup...

[Myford]

Simon
Yes, Johns right, Boyer do several, but with a separate black box. My comfort zone is really Brit bikes, and I suppose I've been spoilt as there is quite a broad choice of EIs. On my Commando I'm currently using a Trispark unit. These were originally developed for the Triumph and BSA triples, but now also make them for most 70s Brit vertical twins. The nice thing about it is it does away with the Mech A & R, and also the whole lot fits under the points cover, no separate box, all very neat, and a Commando must have a quarter of the space under the points cover compared with a CB400.
I'll have a look at the Pamco site. thanks.
Cheers
Terry

[Chris400F]

Pamco information here:
http://www.cb750ignition.com/

I also took a look at the Tri-Spark site, where it says they now have available the FireBox Pro Ignition for the Honda CB750 K series with other versions to follow soon for Japanese, Italian and British Classics. So maybe another option.

[Herr Supersport]

Terry
You ask about experience with coils and electronic ignition. Here it is, I try to keep it short. The bike is a 1975 400 f.
 
Setup:
•   CBR 600 coils
•   Accent CTRL fully programmable ignition [not to confuse with Accent ELZ2coil – what is an electronic on/off switch to replace the points].

Results:
•   starts excellent
•   idles fine and stable with the sound of a sewing-machine
•   improved throttle response – more ‘punch’ between 4000 – 6000 RPM
•   no longer sputter/flat spots when starting from traffic light or agonise in stop-and-go
•   Would do it again

Side-notes:
Modern coils produce stronger sparks – but consume more electrical power. If you connect such a 3Ω coil to points your alternator won’t feed enough juice. This problem can be solved using an electronic trigger with a [coil-]charging time about 120° crankcase-rotation [e.g. Accent ELZ2coil, delivered on demand for low-ohm-coils]. 

Fully programmable ignitions are nice-to-have toys.
Advantages:
•   You are sure the advance begins/ends where you want [and not where an annealed spring tries to act].
•   You are free to fix idle-advance without influence to full advance [mechanical advancers have a fixed range between min–max]. So you can start with 10° idle-advance and give some extra-degrees on max.
•   You can define any dwell-angle so your [modern]-coil gets enough but not too much current.

Disadvantages:
•   Not cheap
•   You need to hide the control unit somewhere

My Ducati is working with the Czech Ignitech without any problem. Unfortunatly the last months I read about problems on newer versions so I decided to not continue this path an bought the German Accent – their standard product [ELZ2coil] satisfied me 100% but I wanted to get rid of the mechanic advancer. You should know that the programmable Accent-version is designed for 750 advancers, the center-bore is 15.0mm, 350/400 is 13.5mm. I solved that by machining a completely new mount.

If you like spending the nights reading basics:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,29545.0.html
Or how a German guy installed Ignitech: http://www.caferacer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=8683

So – hope that helps coming to a decision.

Daniel