Front wheel spindle locking solid

[Laverda Dave]

Hi all,

I think I might have a problem with the front wheel spindle of the 400 project bike and I'm looking for some guidance.

I have installed new wheel bearings supplied by DS into both sides of the wheel.  The spacer has been been refitted as per instructions however...... when I install the wheel spindle and torque it up to the setting as described within the Haynes manual of between 36-39lbs the  spindle goes solid, i.e the wheel will not turn on the spindle. Finger tight all is fine but anything more and it gets harder and harder to spin the wheel.
All the correct spacers have been installed, the new bearings are 'home' and the wheel spindle is greased and everything moves freely. I did notice the bearings supplied from DS are sealed on both sides of the actual bearing where as the ones that came out have the balls exposed on one side although I do not know if these were genuine (and they were worn anyway).  I also noticed the spacer between the bearings have three 'tangs' on each end of the spacer, are these supposed to locate inside the exposed side of the wheel bearings, although obviously they wont locate in the DS supplied bearing as they are sealed!
It appears as though the wheel spindle nut is pushing hard on the adjacent spacer that goes through the dust seal and this is pushing onto the inner bearing race and compressing everything solid?
Am I doing something wrong, is the spindle nut supposed to be torqued as per the Haynes manual or is this one of the Haynes errors?
Dave

[Chris400F]

Dave,
I replaced mine not long ago with a set from All Balls and had no problems.
Sadly I don't seem to have kept the instruction sheet though.
Just a thought - are you putting the axle nut on the right way around?
The hex part goes towards the hub, and as I recall I couldn't torque mine up as I would have needed a very deep socket to reach over the nut to the hex.
Oh, and I think pretty much all bearings are sealed on both sides nowadays. They are sealed for life so you don't have to pack them with grease.
Chris

[Trigger]

Make sure the tags on the collar are not bent and are not in contact with the bearings. Never torqued one up before, just tight.

[florence]

I had this recently.  It all looked fine but would lock up once tight.  I discovered that the bearings just weren't in place far enough.  Another really good few taps with a hammer had them home then it ran fine once tightened.  I used an old wheel spindle passed through the bearings as a drift then gave it a really good whack.

[hairygit]

What Florence? If you drove it in with blows to the inner race failiure in the very near future is almost a certainty!

[florence]

Sorry,  I should have mentioned that one should use a spacer or something to spread the load across the whole of the bearing.  (thanks Hairygit, interested to know what tool you use?)

However you do it though, I am sure you will find it is locking because the bearing is not seated correctly.

[hairygit]

A large old socket which fits the outer race perfectly, then whack the socket. Any impact to the inner race is bad news!

[florence]

thanks for that

[Chris400F]

Using the old bearing to drive in the new has also been suggested. It is the right size ....
Think I used a large socket on the old bearing on the new (if that makes sense), didn't want to risk damage to the outer part of the new bearing from the socket.

[hairygit]

Depending on the bike, you can end up with both the old and new bearing wedged in doing that, and the only way to get them out involves damaging both, that's why I use a socket!

[Chris400F]

Agreed, a degree of caution is necessary.
I think the socket I had was slightly smaller than the bearing hence use of the old bearing which didn't matter if it got damaged.
Sometimes it's a case of doing the best you can with the tools (or improvised tools) that you have available.

[Green1]

Depending on the bike, you can end up with both the old and new bearing wedged in doing that, and the only way to get them out involves damaging both, that's why I use a socket!

Thats what I did when changing the rear bearings in my Dads Triumph   
Second time round I froze the bearings and heated the hub and they just fell in.

Mick

[Chris400F]

As another option, have you tried inserting a finger into the bearings with the spindle removed and seeing how much play there is in the inner spacer, there was always a little in that it was never a real tight fit. If yours is quite loose it would point to the bearings not being fully located.

As I recall there is only a shoulder for the bearing to sit against in one side of the hub.
You fit the first bearing so it is up against this then flip the wheel over, insert the spacer and fit the other bearing.
I found some 'generic' All Balls wheel bearing fitting instructions, which look pretty similar to the ones that came with my bearing kit, which state "Drive the second bearing in until the inner race just touches the center spacer".
I was told to ensure the spacer wasn't bent before fitting the new bearings, which I did.
I don't recall the tangs being long enough to interfere with the bearing, when bent or otherwise, but don't have a hub in pieces to have a closer look.
The instructions worked for me and these were the first wheel bearings I had ever replaced! (Thought I ought to have a go sometime ....).

Generic instructions here if they are any help: http://www.cyclepedia.com/manuals/online/cpp-all-balls/installation-guides/motorcycle-intallation-guides/motorcycle-wheel-bearings/

Also maybe some useful comments in this thread: http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,9736.msg68963.html#msg68963

[Laverda Dave]

Success  .
I made up a 42mm drift from a piece of solid nylon bar (I actually bought it months ago to make some hinges for the front gate but had enough left to make the drift).  This fitted the outside bearing race perfectly.  I was able to give the drift and bearings some seriously heavy thumps with a bolster hammer.  The bearing on the side of the dust seal moved about .5mm but it was enough to give the free play in the spindle I needed.  I did check the spacer to bearing fit after and pleased to say the spacer does still have some free play, not much but enough for it to self centre when the spindle is inserted.

Thank you to everyone for the advice, very much appreciated.  What a great forum and bunch of people on here .

Dave
PS - If it wasn't for my little Myford lathe I couldn't have made the drift (or the gate hinges ), seriously, everyone should have a lathe worth their weight in gold

[Chris400F]

Great stuff! Glad to hear it's sorted.