400/4 rear mudguard variants

[exvalvesetdabbler]

I have recently retired and returned to a bit of bike tinkering now that I have more time on my hands.

Also been having a sort through the loft and come across a few bits that were bought from DSS in the early 90s when he was running small adds' in MCN.  One of the items is a rear mudguard but it is/maybe for a US model and isn't going to fit easily.

- tail light bracket lower mounting hole is just one in the center as opposed to two for the uk spec
- no raised part on the mudguard where the lower part of the bracket  fixes to
- slightly shorter where it would be visible from the back below the number plate.
- fitting as is , the number plate face isn't vertical or angled properly

I want to keep the UK spec tail light bracket mainly because the number plate needs to be retained, It has the original supplying dealer info on it so is part of the bikes history. Can't see the existing holes in the plate having any metal behind them if I use a US spec bracket.

Options

 - find a US spec tail light bracket , probably means re drilling the number plate or an intermediate piece of tin ware to match the two
 - double up on the grommets on the bottom mount and drill a single mounting hole in the center - ugly
 - modify the tail light bracket so that the mounting point sits a cm lower thus raising the bottom of the bracket
-  try to machine up a bit of stainless or aluminum bar  to mimic the raised part on the mudguard and get the number plate sitting plumb.
 
This isn't a concours bike and it never will be. A lot of the original fasteners have been remade  made from stainless and socket cap screws used where things need to be dismantled occasionally.

Also fitting a new chainguard alongside some replica rear shocks.  The original chainguard had a lump hacked out of it to clear the hagon shocks that have always been on it, since 1980 at least for the time that I have had it. [ Guests cannot view attachments ]    

All the best Dave

[Oddjob]

The USA version mudguard is normally a 3 hole version for the number plate bracket, we got the 4 hole version, the 3 holes are mounted in a triangle shape and are quite close together, the small central hole at the base of the guard is for what Honda term a corn plug, basically just a rubber bung that butts against the number plate and stops it vibrating. 3 hole and 4 hole are interchangeable, the mounting system to the frame is the same. Fitting a 4 hole bracket to a 3 hole guard would IMO ruin the guard, where the holes are underneath are reinforced, drilling through a non reinforced area would mean it's weakly mounted and would probably either pull through or dent the guard over time.

[exvalvesetdabbler]

Agree, I did think about drilling through and adding a couple of swage nuts to give two holes along the lower mount, the gusset underneath wide enough and is already there with the single hole in the center. The snag seems to be the bump that the grommets sit on with the UK fender doesn't exist on the US fender. Pattern US brackets have 3 holes so would fit both types of mudguard.

All the best
Dave
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[Oddjob]

If that single lower hole version is the only one you can source then you need one of these I reckon.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173267490175

https://www.ebay.com/itm/126424001786?_skw=Honda+CB400F&itmmeta=01JN771A5MAP1PTX8N1RAKB38K&hash=item1d6f752cfa:g:q7cAAOSwqA1mDDTL&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA0MHg7L1Zz0LA5DYYmRTS30nC4q%2Bhg0X398Ie7bqhoC%2BmQKojfkTE%2F2%2B1FPNvHWB%2BajVRQReaki2Bi4R7I%2BPcnnnREcdTm1NHjdYvBQm3gjDdGynWgPVpZWLPATB5V%2Bcw2B1cVDid0JdXKWwhu2U8zJzNPsIw5H5chfd6e7rZnbMtyV8kBITfDxYRS%2Fp4ApM2ItLNPm4ozHlkvwo4bM8CsD7p%2BHJ3l%2BFermrLcH36iF0JEVLWVT8I4kTkRqXP85x2EWvedhkmnAR7MQVDX%2FmEgEI%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR_yiheepZQ

[exvalvesetdabbler]

I have a plan,  convert the UK bracket to fit a US mudguard.

I attached the tail light bracket with the top two mounts and just the grommets in the bottom two mounts. Turned down a M6 bolt to a sharp point at the end and screwed it in from the back of the mudguard so it was just touching the bracket.  Once the bracket looked straight just gave it a slight tap to mark where the hole needed to go. 

On a new OEM bracket the hole lines up perfectly with the horizontal center line of the existing two holes.

On my old original bracket it's about 2 mm off the horizontal center line, but this bracket is a bit out of shape after having been caught on a spring loaded gate many times in my youth.  Need to
take a hammer to it and see if it can be persuaded  to line up.



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Regards
Dave

[exvalvesetdabbler]

And it fits.

As Milli would say  "I'm pleased with that." Even though it's taken me 30 years to get around to the job.

I'll get it powder coated some time soon.

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Just need to see if the old number plate can be copied to save drilling more holes. I have 3 brackets here and the holes are all over the place.

Any one know if this is possible to get the Honda logos and dealer name put on a new plate, or remember them.  Sadly closed and  a derelict site now.


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Regards Dave.

[honda-san]

I bought all my bikes from Coupland's back in the 70's / 80's. Curiously I spoke to Jim Morley who owned Coupland's only yesterday. Jim will be 80 this year, and sold the business just over 20 years ago now.  Unfortunately the people that took the business over did not make a success of it hence its closure fairly soon afterwards.
Jim still does rebores and a few other things, working from home. He has done all my rebores (about ten now over the last  30 years), and will be doing another CB750 set in the very near future.

[Bryanj]

I am sure Piki on here could copy that sticker for you

[exvalvesetdabbler]

Yes I  have fond memories of Jim and Mick who ran the parts dept.  Sure Mick looked forward to me turning up on a busy Saturday with a long shopping list where he had to look on the microfiche  to get the part numbers.   There was another senior chap who never seemed all that happy can't remember his name though. Less happy when he hurt himself  showing off kickstarting a Norton Commando.

Jim also sold me a new CB200 as my first proper bike and took my battered FISE in exchange.  Wish I still had it now.

Even though it was out the way a bit the shop was always busy.

Regards
Dave