Honda-SOHC

SOHC.co.uk Forums => CB350/400 => Topic started by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 06:52:38 PM

Title: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 06:52:38 PM
How do you remove the fork slider oil seal?
I don't have part 51412-369-000 "Front shock absorber rebound spring" in my forks.
How bad is this?

Many thanks
Tim
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 07:03:08 PM
If they are CB550 F1 forks, they don't have a rebound small spring at the bottom  ;)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 07:08:27 PM
Apart from the spring not being there how else could I tell?
The main spring is linear and not progressive 474mm long.
Any hints for getting the oil seals out?
Many thanks
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 07:13:50 PM
Explained here to remove seals >> http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,20419.30.html
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 07:15:17 PM
There is a member 3SC who has some pictures and measurements of 550 F1, F2 differences  ;)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 07:21:37 PM
Thanks Trigger I'll look at that link.
This is on my 400/4 so thats why I'm confused if its got a different bikes forks on and if that is a concern.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 07:24:30 PM
400 forks should be all the same from standard .
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: 3scs on July 10, 2023, 07:50:05 PM
These pics
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 07:55:47 PM
These pics

Don't worry mate. He has a lower spring missing but, he thinks they may or may not be 400 forks and yours are the 550 differences  ::)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Nurse Julie on July 10, 2023, 07:59:28 PM
Here's the link to my 400 fork refurb

http://www.sohc.co.uk/index.php/topic,14717.0.html
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 08:59:22 PM
Thanks Julie, I ended up using heat to get the seals out. They were very very tight so could be the originals.

I'll get some of the springs and see if they make any difference to the suspension.

Thanks all for your input.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 10, 2023, 09:30:32 PM
These pics

Thanks, Trigger suggested that as my forks had no rebound springs they may be 550 forks.
My for are 555mm in length so defo not 550 forks going by your pics.
Thank you
Tim
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Oddjob on July 10, 2023, 10:51:06 PM
Confused here, it’s posted in the 350/400 section and there are references to both 400 and 550 forks, yet the 400 forks have thinner stanchions than the 500/550 forks so what exactly are we discussing here?
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 11:13:41 PM
Confused here, it’s posted in the 350/400 section and there are references to both 400 and 550 forks, yet the 400 forks have thinner stanchions than the 500/550 forks so what exactly are we discussing here?


You never assume that because a question is in the 400 section that the bike is totally factory standard, as many are not . It may of had the top and bottom yokes changed to 550 and had 550 forks fitted. The bell started ringing when was mentioned that it did not have a rebound spring and the CB550F1 never came with a rebound spring  ;D
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Oddjob on July 10, 2023, 11:21:18 PM
True but most 400 fork conversions were to something like the 250N which wouldn’t involve swapping the yokes, maybe he can measure the width of the stanchions and that would provide a better idea of what’s been done in the past.

A swapping to 500/550 forks would have also most likely involved changing the front wheel to a 19” one or the discs, mudguard etc would have proved a problem. Not seen a 400 with a 500/550 forks on for that reason.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 10, 2023, 11:44:05 PM
You need to look at some 400 cafe racers. I have had two in my workshop with a 550 front end fitted and one guy that had up side down forks fitted  ;)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on July 11, 2023, 01:13:08 AM
I am confused by this thread as it seems to start off as a 400 with missing rebound springs.

Is your bike a 400 with standard 400 forks with just the small sprigs missing or do you know it has none standard forks/front end?

Some pics of your dismantled front forks might be useful here.

Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Athame57 on July 11, 2023, 02:23:40 AM
Thanks Trigger I'll look at that link.
This is on my 400/4 so thats why I'm confused if its got a different bikes forks on and if that is a concern.
You might want to make sure they are not from a different bike. I don't want to sound glum but in my youth I bought a Kawasaki Z400J that turned out to have a Z500 front end from the yoke down. It came to light after I destroyed the rim of front wheel in a pothole.  ::)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 11, 2023, 09:26:04 AM
I am confused by this thread as it seems to start off as a 400 with missing rebound springs.

Is your bike a 400 with standard 400 forks with just the small sprigs missing or do you know it has none standard forks/front end?

Some pics of your dismantled front forks might be useful here.

You and me too.
I think because of the missing rebound springs he suggested that it could have forks from another machine.
Confirmation that they are 400/4 forks would now be of help!
The front wheel is 18", stanchions are 555x33mm and are 172ish between centres.
I'm pretty sure they are standard 400/4 forks but with missing springs.

Anyone want to comment on the effectiveness of the missing springs or not? Probably not an experiment anyone has done.
Cheers all.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Oddjob on July 11, 2023, 01:29:21 PM
Only around £4 each and available, why not just buy 2 and solve the problem?
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 11, 2023, 01:33:12 PM
Thats what I'm going to do, problem solved.
Just curious as why anyone would remove them in the first place.

My forks have subsequently self identified as 400/4 forks and I can report they feel at peace with themselves for the first time in 24hrs.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Nurse Julie on July 11, 2023, 01:48:29 PM

My forks have subsequently self identified as 400/4 forks and I can report they feel at peace with themselves for the first time in 24hrs.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Bryanj on July 11, 2023, 02:38:05 PM
They didnt remove them, they fell off and were not noticed
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on July 11, 2023, 02:53:58 PM
Interesting to see the difference between 400 & 500 fork innards - no big long bolt thingy- my 400 already had new seals fitted so it was the only part of my 400 that I did not rebuild.

One of the things for the future is to drain my 400 fork oil & see if it looks clean - I have that as a job for winter 2023/4 depending on my enthusiasm/motivation status.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 11, 2023, 11:33:24 PM
They didnt remove them, they fell off and were not noticed

Or they are stuck in the bottom of the stanchions ? ;)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 12, 2023, 12:04:08 AM
Good shout but sadly not. Had a good rummage and tapped the stanchion on the bench and nought fell out or is visible.
Steve Cooper has a pair on their way to me so all should be sorted in a couple of days.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Oddjob on July 12, 2023, 02:57:00 AM
I would strongly advise you finding a piece of wire, forming a fish hook in the end of it and fishing around at the bottom of the stanchions just in case. I’ve seen slime/mud/crap at the bottom of sliders that defies belief and that would be able to hold a small spring like that in place no problem.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Trigger on July 12, 2023, 08:20:35 AM
Good shout but sadly not. Had a good rummage and tapped the stanchion on the bench and nought fell out or is visible.
Steve Cooper has a pair on their way to me so all should be sorted in a couple of days.

I was doing a set of forks on a FJ1200 recently and the rebound springs were well and truly stuck in the bottom of the stanchions so, get a light in there and see what you can see. You don't want two lots of rebound springs in a fork  ;)
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on July 12, 2023, 09:39:26 AM
When dismantling my 500 forks the bottom of the stations were black with crud - I washed them out with Petrol using a long brush to agitate the stubborn residue. I resorted to using a long piece  of 15 mm plastic pipe with some cloth attached to the end with tape to clean it all off. I shone  a torch down the stantion to ensure it was spotless.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 12, 2023, 10:11:56 AM
Had a good furgle down the stanchions and no spring came to light.
They are pretty clean but will give them a going over with brake cleaner and a brush.
Took a pic with a cheap endoscope camera.
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: McCabe-Thiele (Ted) on July 12, 2023, 10:28:23 AM
Nice picture what causes the central brown circle?
Title: Re: Front end renovation
Post by: Multiman on July 12, 2023, 10:37:10 AM
It's my floor! I held the stanchion vertical in the vice